Arsenal News
Arsenal News & Transfers
As featured on NewsNow: Arsenal newsArsenal News 24/7

Arsenal News, Only Arsenal, Blogs, Transfer News

Archives

August 2017
M T W T F S S
« Jul    
 123456
78910111213
14151617181920
21222324252627
28293031  

Arsène Wenger and the moral dilemma over Suárez – A Rebuttal

Arsène Wenger and the moral dilemma over Suárez – A Rebuttal

By Bootoomee

—————-

Dear Dominic Sanchez-Cabello,

The beauty of Untold is the variety of thoughts and divergence of beliefs even if it is a primarily positive and pro-Arsenal site. Now having said this, I disagree with most of the premise of your article. But before I lay out my objections, I want to quickly clear something up.

In previous articles on Suárez, I was perhaps the most vocal opponent of the player. I am still. I hope we NEVER sign him. However, as I was expressing my opposition then, I used some words that I have thought more about and now want to take back.

I said that my respect for Arsène Wenger will be diminished and that my support for AFC will become lukewarm. I take these words back. It is VERY unfair on my part to use this one case against a man’s 17 years record or a club’s 127 years record. I will continue to respect Arsène Wenger and my love for and support for Arsenal will endure, Suarez or no Suarez.

I will never be a fan of Suarez though. I will not boo him when he wears the shirt but I will not be enthusiastic about him either.

Now to my point-by-point objections to your article:

I disagree with your reference to use of a loophole to sign a player as “dishonourable”. I find that line so unbelievable that I have to rub my eyes and read it thrice to believe that you actually wrote that! You may not like the use of loopholes, but they are not dishonourable. Have you ever had legal entanglements with little hope for justice even though you are on the right side? Would you call your lawyer dishonourable if he was able to get you justice via a loophole?

I know you are trying to make light of the biting incidents but I don’t find them funny. I have under-2 kids who don’t even bite any more! Plus, he is a serial biter! It is a disgusting and irrational habit for a grown man. Cantona’s kung fu kick was terrible but while I will never do that to anyone, as a man, I can understand physical violence in response to provocations, although I strongly disapprove. Biting is something totally different. Besides, the tangle between him and Ivanovic at the time was perfectly fair and normal in football. The guy is just plain nuts!

My biggest issue is racism. This is one area that Gooners who were looking forward to Suarez winning trophies for us are most willing to rationalise or overlook. This is made convenient for them by the lack of video (or even audio) evidence unlike the two biting cases that have unspinnable records. The racism issue is being eagerly cloaked with garbs of uncertainty and forgiveness by Gooners.

Not me.

As a black man living in a predominantly white country, I understand racism because it is a regular feature in my own life. I have ‘sucked up’ too many instances of racism because it is taboo to even talk about unless you have concrete hard evidence.

But the racist is aware of the stigma that the society attaches to the behaviour, so it is really rare to get hard evidence in racist incidents. They know what they can get away with and what buttons they can and cannot push. If I get called a n****r with no willing witnesses around, the abuser just needs to shed tears and fake outrage about being accused of racism and I will end up being accused of playing the race card!

I also think the excessive outrage from the public in racist cases often turns the perpetrators to become the victims. But all in all, racism is alive and well in England, even though the people will fight this notion with all the strength in their being.

In laying my case against Suarez, I am going to be 100% fair to him on this matter by using his own account of the incident:

Evra (another player that I cannot stand and not because he plays for Man United. I like Vidic very much) taunted Suárez repeatedly. Then Suárez used a word that is perfectly normal to use on black people in Uruguay.

At this point, Suárez is still doing fine.

Then Evra complained and there was public outrage. The term used by Suárez is considered offensive in England. Suárez’s reaction from this point on is where he lost me and why I refuse to accept the earlier premise that he meant no harm or offence.

I will use an anecdote that I have posted in a comment on Untold in the past. I came from a very homophobic society. It will be considered offensive in my country of birth to say nice things about gays or to even defend them from their tormentors.

A few weeks after my arrival in the United Kingdom, I used a slur against a gay actor while watching TV with my cousin and host. He enlightened me on homosexuality and the fact that civilised and open minded people have no reasons to indulge in homophobic thoughts, sentiments or attitudes. My stance towards homosexuals changed that evening!

Even if Suárez’s word choice is mainstream in Uruguay, a better person would be genuinely apologetic when he finds out that it is offensive here and make genuine effort to apologise and bury the hatchet. Even if provoked in the first place. I guess many of the readers would have been in situations where you ended up apologising to provocateurs because you reacted in a harsher or less acceptable manner. I know have. I did not enjoy it, but it was the right thing to do.

Wayne Bridge refused to shake John Terry’s hand because he slept with his wife. Perfectly understandable! Suárez’s refusal to shake Evra’s hand should be rationalised as what? Sulking for being called out for using racially offensive language against another human being, even if he is as despicable as Evra? And please don’t say that he apologised, that was a template written by someone in Liverpool media and communications department. Besides, refusing to shake the hand of the victim of his action after the apology basically nullifies the apology. It also shows Suárez’s gross lack of maturity.

Like I have always said, there is nothing I or any other fan can do about which player is signed or not signed by Arsenal. I understand and respect this fact as anybody who might have read one of my tirades against the buy-buy-buy brigade can tell. What I am against here, as I was in that Walter’s article, is the 180 degrees that Arsenal fans are now making on Suárez and the revisionism and selective amnesia that is now prevalent in Goonershere on his actions. Dominic Sanchez-Cabello’s piece is along this line, hence this rebuttal.

I will finish by reiterating that whatever Arsène does on Suarez, I will continue to be a loyal supporter of Arsenal Football Club and our manager, ArsèneWenger while hoping that the club does not regret the decision to bring the player to the Emirates.

54 comments to Arsène Wenger and the moral dilemma over Suárez – A Rebuttal

  • Bootoomee

    Dominic Sanchez-Cabello,

    In case you are wondering, this piece was sent to Tony before our exchanges yesterday.

  • Yassin

    Agree totally,but you seem to forget the most annoying thing he does, in my point of view, diving (cheating), he even had sometimes a straight chance on goal in which he could score, still he will dive.
    We are arsenal and we hate cheating, specially here on untold.
    Other than that i totally agree with you

  • Bootoomee

    Yassin,

    Thanks.

    I agree with you on the cheating but it was not included in the article because I was mainly responding to the biting and racist issues and how our fans are making a u-turn to rationalise themin anticipation of his arrival at the Emirates.

    Also to be fair, Dominic Sanchez-Cabello has always been consistent on his position.

  • Shard

    Bootoomee

    Yassin brought up the point I too was going to make.The way Suarez plays the game itself goes against our ethos. But I reckon that will reduce, if not stop entirely, because Wenger generally doesn’t seem to have divers in his team.

    Again. The biting. I have an issue with it because not only is it disgusting, it harms the club both on and off the field.

    The racism charge. I agree with you. Not that he had to apologise to Evra. But he should at least have acknowledged that the use of the word was incorrect and that he will make a conscious effort to not use it, in any context. Even if he explained that it is normal to use in Uruguay.

    I also especially agree that the extreme, let’s say, ‘armchair’ outrage shown towards racism, can end up making the perpetrator look like a victim, and maybe also feel like one.

    What was galling about not shaking Evra’s hand wasn’t that he didn’t do it. I mean who would want to shake Evra’s hand. I don’t believe that was wrong. What was wrong was that Liverpool had advised him to go through with the ceremony and he had agreed. But at the last, he let them down.

    The guy is a liability. My only consolation in this is that I don’t think he won’t be treated with kid gloves at Arsenal, like he was with Liverpool. Players like Arteta, Per, and Wilshere will have an input, and get him to behave, and the management will certainly not back him even when unjustified. Like Liverpool and their t-shirts.

    I don’t think Suarez is a racist. I do think he’s an accident waiting to happen. Can we beat the odds and avoid it happening? Remains to be seen, but I’m not very confident.

  • kazeem

    Hi,
    what I don’t understand is why you people keep on replaying all these shotcomimgs of a good player without judging suarez from his angle rather than your understanding of his crimes.
    we should understand that suarez is not from europe which create a huge cultural difference in his behaviour and yours, a biting insident that neither draw blood nor leave a scar(be it temporary or permanent). He is not the only player that dive and am not sure he deserves a medal if you critically conduct a research along that line (I don’t believe in destuctively analyses of people, would have mentioned few divers in the pl).
    while I don’t support suarez behaviour, I don’t see a rational behind continous flogging of a man who had apologised to those offended and trying to swim out of his present travail. how many of us can survive this public onslaught?
    if yours don’t see suarez as an human being then remember we are not saints, we all have our shortcomings which we are trying to change or which people just choose to overlook.

  • nicky

    All these pros and cons about Suarez is beginning to pall a bit. On the one hand you have the moral high ground, an easy stance to take since the guy is merely an employee of another club.
    Then you have the fence-sitter. He doesn’t like Suarez and what he represents, but keeps quiet in case we sign him, in which event he will say he’s the best buy since Arsene
    introduced sushi to Britain.
    And then finally there is the professorial type who waits quietly for the outcome. If he joins Arsenal, the jury will be out on him for some time. He could turn out to be a real gold-mine, anxious to prove himself “down South” and on the Continent. There can be little doubt, though, that wherever he ends up, he will be a marked man in British football, for sometime to come. That in itself will be a real test of his character.

  • Matt

    Maybe you should spend more time looking after your your young children instead of writing on here and do us all a favour.

  • colario

    Suarez, a racist and biter, will he continue in this way? Who knows.
    I posted this on the first blog on this subject and it remains true.

    “Suarez is a red card waiting to happen. Some Refs would love it if he were to come to Arsenal. If he comes to Arsenal he will not play for Arsenal— he will play for himself!”

  • para

    That’s it, if he comes to Arsenal, we know what will happen. Arsenal is already targeted by refs and media, adding a lit fuse to that means we are going to be more targeted. For all his talent, (forget diving, this is rampant in football and only becomes diving when the media enhances it) i am beginning to see that it is not a good idea for him to join Arsenal.
    Wenger seems to always leave an opening for players to choose themselves if they really want to move to Arsenal, and expects action from them to make it happen.
    //
    On racism in UK, i do notice it is still ongoing. I do not worry if anyone calls me nigger or things like that, that does not bother me, i could retaliate if i needed to by using words. What bothers me is the hidden racism, which is perpetuated by the media, movies, series and by a company when one goes for a job. But the most annoying is when you go into a store, and is (STILL in 2013) followed by the store detective. What a laugh. We used to make their life hell as a response, by acting more suspicious.
    //
    I have come to the conclusion that racism is something that can only die out slowly over generations, as children are taught differently, but sadly there are those who do not want it gone, and also sadly, they usually have the power to keep it in existence.
    Nuff said.

  • Mike

    I’ve disliked the grubby little man since his handball at the World Cup a few years ago, and nothing he has done since has endeared him to me in any way. If we sign him – and I don’t think we will – then he’ll get my support when he’s on the field, but beyond that I’ll continue to despise him until he eventually agitates a move away from the club. Regardless of his talent as a footballer, i feel signing him would be a grave error that will return to bite us in arse sooner rather than later.

    The saddest thing about this whole affair are the sheer number of fans who have changed (or are quietly changing) their tune regarding his antics, and the amount of people who are emerging from the woodwork in support of him – people who clearly have no problem with his behavior in the past.

    We’re better than Suarez. He might be able to kick a ball with style, but he’s a shambles of a human being, and for that reason I think we should stay well clear of this toxic player.

  • Adesoji Adekunle

    Dear Gunners, we all have our shortcomings. As normal humanbeings, we are bound to make one mistake or the other at a particular time. We shouldn’t over emphasise his shortcomings. Wenger might be SUAREZ’s Messaiah in disguise, you never can tell. AW has managed players worse than him, today they are role models. As sturbon as Balotelli is, today you hardly hear bad things about him compare to when he played in EPL. Let’s give him love if he eventually comes in. There is nothing God can not do. Diving, bitting, racism all these will surely become a thing of the past. How many world class strikers do we have left in the market? Primarily, all we need is 30goals in a season hitman. He lives up to expectation. In Wenger we trust. Gunners 4 life.

  • Yassin

    It is not that we are all saints and he is a biter and racist so we dont want him. it is the whole package he get with him that we dont have at Arsenal, his character is just unacceptable. people do sometime mistakes, we all do, it is after that were the real you shows, and he showed what he is.

  • marcus

    I don’t think it’s a moral dilemma though; it’s a moral choice.

    If a club has signed, or attempted to sign, (as Arsenal have – they have tried to sign Suarez), someone you find morally reprehensible, then you simply need to cancel the season ticket and say I refuse to support this club.

    If enough people took a moral stance in life, the world would change.

  • I think there is a good point above.

    We know, because of Walter’s work and everything on the Referee Decisions web site that Arsenal are getting a bad deal from refs.

    With Suarez we will be slaughtered.

  • Yassin

    @Tony ,
    I think we are slaughtered enough, they cant anymore than what they did,can they?
    If he comes in and behave well its all good, but what if he doesn`t?

    And yes he is talented, but i guess Wenger can get someone as talented as he is and for cheaper, another Henry i think…..

  • Adam

    All that aside, he still isn’t a productive team player. A goal scorer yes. His stats speak for themselves, he gives the ball away too much. Could he fit in with the way we play? yes, but at the cost of the other outfield nine working harder. His goals to shots ratio isn’t great either, but with the amount of chances we create that won’t be noticed until the really close games. I still cannot get my head around why we are going for him but that’s why Wenger is at the helm and im just another online opinion.

  • Adam

    @Matt, that comment was extremely callous. Shows how shallow you are. I started to write pieces when I was bound to the house due to the boy being in bed early, how do you know it’s not the same for Bootoomee.

  • Brickfields Gunners

    @ Adam – chill pill of the day !

    “Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don’t matter, and those who matter don’t mind.”
    ― Bernard M. Baruch

  • marcus

    The whole Suarez affair may actually be a huge double whammy for Arsenal I am afraid.

    For one they are unlikely to get the player anyhow, but having bid for him, they have laid themselves open to scrutiny by the fanbase.

    If enough Arsenal supporters thought it wrong to have bid for Suarez, and therefore cancelled their season tickets, it would create big problems for the club.

  • Brickfields Gunners

    My sentiments exactly ,but in others’ wise words .

    A lot of people are afraid to tell the truth, to say no. That’s where toughness comes into play. Toughness is not being a bully. It’s having backbone.
    Robert Kiyosaki

    If you have to lie, cheat, steal, obstruct and bully to get your point across, it must not be a point capable of surviving on its own merits.
    Steven Weber

    You know, what we do know is that there is a high frequency of violence in the home of those who bully.
    Phil McGraw

    I am all for cracking down on inappropriate digital behaviour. Too often the connected world is an excuse for some coward hiding behind a keyboard to bully someone else.
    Tony Parsons

    When people don’t like themselves very much, they have to make up for it. The classic bully was actually a victim first.
    Tom Hiddleston

    To me, I definitely stand in the corner of wanting to give voice to the bullied, and not the bully.
    Mike White

  • Adam

    Brickfields, are you on facebook?

  • bennie

    I personally care really less if Arsene signs him and he performs.

    I’m NOT a fan of his antics, but I’m a huge admirer of his football.

    We all learn, and I’m sure from all this scrutiny he’s learning. He will become a far better player at Arsenal than many of ‘YOU’ pessimistic minds contemplate.

  • Brickfields Gunners

    Yes ,but I am not active and more or less post the same jokes,articles and clips as I do here .
    My kids don’t want me as their friend .I also don’t post personal stuff or photos .Its quite boring there !
    Some of my best work would be on here ! Whats that booing sound ?

  • Brickfields Gunners

    A VERY FAITHFUL WOMAN

    An elderly lady was well-known for her faith and for her boldness in talking about it. She would stand on her front porch and shout “PRAISE THE LORD!”

    Next door to her lived an atheist who would get so angry at her proclamations he would shout, “There ain’t no Lord!!”

    Hard times set in on the elderly lady, and she prayed for GOD to send her some assistance. She stood on her porch and shouted “PRAISE THE LORD. GOD I NEED FOOD!! I AM HAVING A HARD TIME. PLEASE LORD, SEND ME SOME GROCERIES!!”

    The next morning the lady went out on her porch and noted a large bag of groceries and shouted, “PRAISE THE LORD.”

    The neighbour jumped from behind a bush and said, “Aha! I told you there was no Lord. I bought those groceries, God didn’t.”

    The lady started jumping up and down and clapping her hands and said,”PRAISE THE LORD. He not only sent me groceries, but He made the devil pay for them. PRAISE THE LORD!”

  • Brickfields Gunners

    Holding on to anger is like grasping a hot coal , with the
    intent of throwing it at someone else ; you are the one who gets burned .
    Buddha

  • bob

    Bootoomee,
    To say it up front, no one was on the pitch to witness the exact interchange between the two non-saints, Evra and Suarez.
    But I find their disastrous encounter on the pitch well worth the focus you place on it.

    These thoughts have occurred to me as possible factors to consider in reaching a conclusion, as their encounter and its non-hand shake/non-repenting aftermath have become a litmus test of Suarez’s moral acceptability to AFC (or anywhere):
    Suarez has a black father.
    Evra, 32, is a Senegal-born black man, raised in France (and played for his hometown French club), brought over by Ferguson in 2006 and, via Fergie’s embrace, has seemingly become (relatively) accepted in UK via the MU link.
    Suarez, 25, is a Uruguay-born man of mixed race parentage who was moved to the Netherlands at 19 years old, not acclimated to Europe, and then leaves Europe for Liverpool AFC in winter 2011 as a phenom.

    Evra, in football terms and perhaps in daily life terms, seems more settled in English lifeways than Suarez. On the pitch Evra has 6-7 years of EPL service at Manure vs. 2-plus for Suarez. Evra, no saint, is a notable tough-guy and well-known as wind-up artist on the pitch. His nasty wind-ups of Arsenal, especially two seasons ago, were well covered in the anti-AFC press such as the Guardian football section. His macho posturing on Manure’s behalf got my attention a few years back; and I have labeled him “Macho Evra” in these pages, especially during the summer of Cesc as AW was the persistent target from all sides, on and off the pitch.

    Evra has also shown that he knows how to work the media; and has been a media go-to guy for quotes that plant some of his own and Ferguson’s psychological barbs vs. upcoming opponents. I’ve found him to be (in football terms) a protected man. I can’t prove the exact number of uncarded fouls – well known protection as many have witnessed, even at Old Trafford, 2004, against us – that he, like hard-man Vidic, have committed; but perhaps a review of the pro-Manure bias over the last few years can turn these up.

    In several areas, then, Evra knows how to practice the arts and crafts of pushing the envelope up to the line. If, as has been reported here by a UA contributor (referencing the official incident report) that the comparatively well-settled Evra had called the comparative newcomer (and Liverpool talisman) Suarez “negrito”, in the heat of competition, then, imo, there is a strong, reasonable possibility that Evra figured out (or easily knows how) to goad any player he wishes to target. Is it not possible – possible – that Evra goaded Suarez into a retaliation to get him sent off? (Not unlike Marco Materazzi targeted Zidane in the 2006 World Cup and drew a head-but retaliation after zeroing in on Zidane’s sister or mother for a vicious verbal insult.)

    All this said, why should Suarez shake the hand of the man who may well have set the trap that cost him personally and his team a succession of damages in the media and on the pitch?
    I’m not saying that many could not have thought it over and helped to de-fuse the racial aura that coated this incident. And given the notorious pro-Manure bias of the media, is it not possible that, outside Liverpool, Suarez had become ‘the racist’ (if not incorrigible racist) and Evra ‘the aggrieved innocent’?

    As a reader, without much of a second thought, and because I always show students video examples of racism on the pitch, I quickly took Evra’s side. However, on further reflection since Suarez is on the cusp of joining AFC, I’ve revisited the scene of his crime. My reflections are in this posting. To conclude,
    I don’t see the basis for concluding that Suarez is racist for refusing to shake Evra’s hand. That is, after an 8-game suspension and a 40,000 pound fine, I think it’s understandable and just as possible that this is mostly personal, and about being bested and outfoxed by Evra; that Evra, no saint, knows how to use his push the envelope and cast the outsider as the villain, as Suarez, no saint, had well realized this. While it’s far from easy for some to take the higher ground that you have designated in this piece as the test of his redeemability as a person and as a potential AFC member. If there is anything by half to this contextual considerations, does Suarez deserve unbending condemnation?

  • bob

    Sorry, meant to write above “that Evra knows how to use his protected niche to push the envelope and…”

  • Yassin

    @ Bob,
    Agree on your analysis, nut still, its not only about racism, its more than that,… biting, diving,… this man is not Arsenal class, unless he is willing to change.
    Anyway i do trust Arsene judgement on whatever he choose to.
    The challenge lies in is he willing to go under Arsene`s guidance or not?

  • bob

    Yassin,
    Agreed, he’s not class, and I don’t argue that he is. Also agree that AW has got to live with him, has the pulse of this team and its chemistry, and will choose to or not. Also, I don’t imagine that if AFC players and Liverpool players were to regard Suarez as a racist and terrible teammate (to be), and having competed against him on the pitch, that they would not have raised an in-house protest against him. Perhaps there’s evidence of that, but I haven’t seen it.

  • marcus

    @Bob

    The Suarez Evra case was quite murky. Well murky at least to those of us who
    1) think the FA are, erm, not very transparent or particularly fine purveyors of natural justice, who
    2) literally don’t believe a word the British media says.

    That doesn’t exculpate anyone though…it just means the truth is maybe harder to grasp with certainty in the Suarez matter. There are probably 1001 things you can say about the Suarez matter. But a couple of things suffice for me for now

    1) At what point would you stop supporting a club on moral grounds? If a player was found guilty in court of rape and kept on by the club? If the player was found guilty in court of a racial assault and kept on by the club? If the player was found guilty in court of assaulting a woman and signed by another club?

    There are recent instances of the last two examples. A couple of Leeds players not so long ago, and a Hull(?) player. ((I think I am getting my facts right!))

    For me personally, while I think forgiveness is important in society, I wouldn’t want to support those kinds of clubs, Leeds and the team that signed the guy that battered the woman in the club, with those kinds of players besmirching their ranks.

    2) “Racism” itself is a false term really, even if we know roughly what it means, and have all probably experienced it at some time in our life. But since we are all members of one race, the human race, it’s hard to see how we can be racist. Correctly speaking we are talking about tribalism.

    The irony of course is that football is itself incredibly tribalistic. Clubs themselves are like tribes in themselves….and the hatred between footballing tribes is often pretty vile. Does the FA etc do anything about this form of tribalism?

  • John L

    i dont think wenger has any ‘moral’ dilemma with saurez. not because arsene isnt a principled man but because he is a coach at heart. as with RVP who came with some serious questions over his attitude and with a alleged rape case overhead, wenger as a coach feels he can rehabilitate and and focus players. even if he privately dislikes certain behavior…he will always feel that people can change for the better…its part of what makes him a great coach.

  • bob

    marcus,
    Brilliant reply. I concur with every word.
    When it comes to an assault, an outright racist or tribalist assault, or whipping up an atmosphere to promote that, that’s where I’d draw the line. Cheers 🙂

  • bob

    marcus,
    That’s why I cringed when the press were publishing at this time least season the possibility that we were considering Joey Barton as a hard-man presence, etc. “Our Joey” made his meal as a serial wind-up artist and serial assaulter, including attacks on Sagna and Eboue and Gervinho as I remember. I would have made continual protest against his contemplated or actual signing hereabouts. On moral grounds, for me, any team that would sign a player who physically attacked its own would not have been worthy of further support.

  • John L

    i think something that is often overlooked in regards to saurez’s behavior is that it never seems out of control to me. i know this sounds strange…let me explain.

    the hand ball incident in the world cup. it may have been somewhat unsporting, but he rationalized the options in a instant and made his move. no different than a ‘professional’ foul from a defender.

    the alleged racism incident with evra. we cannot hear what the players say on the pitch. my guess is there is a lot of homophobic, racist and nationalist banter between players on the pitch. it doesnt excuse the behavior, but possibly makes it harsh to single out specific players. evra has a bit of a nasty steak in him, and like suarez, relishes getting under an opponents skin, if he feels it will give him an advantage. probably a case of saurez’s wrong not making evra right….

    saurez gets kicked alot, he also dives alot, he is willing to bite and talk shit to opponents. all in the effort to win. i believe he is aware of his actions and feels they are part of his game. i think he is a player that gets calmer the more angry his opponents get and the he specifically tries to create that atmosphere on the pitch.

    and that really is the key for me. all of these things happen on the pitch! whether cultural or coached this is saurez’s game, not necessarily who he is off the pitch. i would be far more alarmed if he bit someone on the street or was fighting at a bar, or if non-latino or non-caucasian teamates were unwilling to work with him. which isnt the case, everywhere he has been those that work with him daily have the utmost praise for his professionalism, attitude and team spirit.

    his actions on the pitch are not always commendable, but lets not pretend that we know this man. i think back to people like ashley cole, you hate him unless he plays for your team, or pires diving every now and then to win us a goal….having someone in your team with a win at all costs mentality can be good, as long as you have balance.

    and i think that is possibly part of why wenger is after saurez….even if it does bring some baggage with it…

  • bob

    john L,
    To you point about other players’ reactions, Jack Wilshere is being quoted in many parts today online and in the press as approving of our signing Suarez.

  • John L

    hahaha can i also point out that neither biting incident drew blood…so its not as if he really locked his jaw, and they both happen when tussling with an opponent…its not as if he walked up to ivanovic like he was on bath salts…

  • John L

    maybe its like jordan sticking out his tongue, or my brother who when dribbling clenches his fists, or when you accidently brush against another players junk….

    maybe saurez is thinking ‘goddamnit, why does that happen?’

    …like me when i accidently grab a little tit when playing co-ed? its easy to say i tried to do it, i might have even looked can i bad…but it happens when you play…

    looking forward to see how wenger goes about training saurez to play with his mouth closed?

  • Shakabula Gooner

    Bootoomee,

    Frankly, I was indifferent to the uproar about Suarez in respect of Evra. Indeed, I felt that it was a sad commentary on the EPL complaint management process that John Terry, with TV video evidence, angrily mouthing expletives against Anton Ferdinand could win his case but not Suarez who wasn’t given the benefit of the doubt. After the Zidane experience, I felt a lot of crazy talk went on between players as part of the psychological warfare that goes on on the pitch among them. So, it seems that homophobic, sexual, racial, etc., cussing goes on from the start to the end of each match. It is par for the course and it doesn’t seem to affect the same players partying hard together when the can.

    Indeed, I think it breaks some unwritten code among them for one person or the other to then turn around to make such mighty fuss about it as Evra, Anton and, indeed, Zidane did. To boot, the fuss cost Suarez several weeks in monetary and disciplinary doghouse. As a result, I fully understand why he rejected Evra’s handshake. You could’t have overreacted so vigorously and cost him so much in reputation, etc., and then expect a superficial “all is well” handshake from such an emotional or passionate man as Suarez.

    On the other hand, what defined Suarez for me was an incident in 2010 World Cup in South Africa. Uruguay vs. Ghana. Suarez, instinctively dived and caught a goal bound ball in the dying minutes of normal time that would have given the semi final qualification to Ghana. He got his red card and Ghana@s Gyan went on to boot the spot kick over the bar. In the ensuring extra time play, Uruguay won the day. That says to me that the guy is very passionate and will do his best and beyond to win a match.

    Yes, in respect of the 2 players he bit, his sundry dives and his been fingered by Koscielny as the player he hates the most to play against, his passion needs some taming but I don’t rate this as anything more that a stricter team environment and quality mentoring cannot deal with – without him losing his winning edge/drive.

    Lastly, in the civil matters that are Suarez’s current “baggage”, since he has been duly punished over them, we have to accept that he has earned the right to live on as a normal citizen and that the punishments have had their required deterrent effect – at least, until he does the same thing again. I mean, he is not a serial rapist or pedophile or the kind. He is a crazy, good footballer, in a crazy good world; a world where we are obliged to not be hypocrites – overtly or permanently.

  • kazeem

    @ John L, Bob and Yassin
    The closest analogy to this suarez issue is that of water in a cup that can either be seen AS HALF FILL OR HALF EMPTY.

    is suarez attitude worse than that of the italian player that insulted that celebrated sport ambassador from france? what will make a player be enraged to the point of hitting another player on the pitch? there is no wjere that insident was analyzed without people making reference to what that italian said to the bald footballer before his reacction that eventually cost his country that trophy. was it recorded that that one time world best player apologised for headbutting that italian guy after the match?
    Yassin, was there any reporter or writer who manage to ask suarez what evra said to him or did? was there anytime we see evra as a guy that can provoke anger from a fellow player? did any of us bother to ask suarez what that guy from france said to him?
    can we call this double standard from you people?

    why would I want to shake hand with a foe that set me up, when everybody see him as innocent on issue that he engineered? remember that there was onetime full back who refused to sake hand with his captain because he slept with his wife. is it not possible for that former city player to see his wife as a slut that seduced that skipper? afterall it takes two to play that game and it wasn’t reported anywhere that there was an element of force entry.
    my point is footballers are human being with their own shortcomings and there is always a two sides to any interesting discussion.

    thanks

  • kazeem

    Was there any reason to why a skipper of a national team made a racist comment to a fellow player from same country? what was the reaction of the entire media to it? why suspend hearing in that case till the end of nations cup?

    what will you people’s comment if AW is interested in signing that skipper from west london team or that footballer that captain the football team of the great britain to the last olympic game?

  • Bootoomee

    Matt (@10.46am),

    I look after my children just fine. How do you think they end up not biting before they clock 2?

    I’m not sure that your parents took care of you though with the utter lack of class in your comment.

  • Bootoomee

    I spent the whole day at the Emirates cup, so I have been unable to respond to comments in my typical manner. Other than Matt who is a classless imbecile, I really don’t see any need to respond to any of the comments to be honest. It appears like we all have our minds made up about the player right now and not many are going to change their position.

    It was never my intention to change anyone’s mind though. I write to argue a position that I believe in or show why I disagree with some other points. I don’t think people’s minds are that easily changed anyway. At least not on a topic that everyone is familiar with like the Suarez person.

    I have a problem with moral elasticity which people usually exhibit when specific acts of immoralty do not personally affect them or if they think that they stand to gain from them.

  • uk

    @bootoomee
    great (@your 9:46pm). you now insult people’s parents? i guess you are now AAA…
    im surprised your gang havent started saying “tony/walter, surely bootoomee’s 9:46 has earned him a time out…”

  • Florian

    uk et all,

    You’re lucky you live in a society that values the freedom of opinion. The insults you spew out should have had you banned a long time ago. Bear that in mind next time you travel east of Germany.

  • blacksheep63

    @Bootoomee excellent post sir, totally agree with you. However, doubt we need to worry over much because it seems highly unlikely that Saurez is coming to Arsenal if the interviews on BBC five live yesterday are to be believed.

  • andy bishop

    Many in Spain believe we got Cazorla as Malaga needed the money. Liverpool do not need the money…there is no chance we will go anywhere near Liverpool’s valuation.

  • uk

    @florian
    yea, i was the one who said someone’s parents didnt take care of him, you’re lucky u speak in a virtual environment, your teeth probably would have been banned from your mouth a long time ago, bear that in mind anytime you get out of bed

  • Bootoomee

    uk,

    You are a moron. I never respond to your posts because I don’t pick on children and the mentally retarded. I know you are one or both of these.

    A smarter or more mature person will check the context of the matter before dabbling in. Especially as I provided the time of the particular comment that I was referring to so that any fair and intelligent person who feel aggrieved by my tone can first check out the original comment first.

    Of course I don’t expect this from you. You are not intelligent. And neither are you fair.

  • Bootoomee

    blacksheep63,

    I say hurray to that! I hope it is true.

  • uk

    yayyy, the great AKB abuser is around. why not go into a tirade on how AAAs love to abuse… hypocrite shite

  • uk

    so someone says you’re not doing a good job writing posts and you’ll do better taking care of your kids, thats the go ahead to say his parents didnt take care of him?

  • uk

    and please if your response is not gonna be intelligent(just littered with expletives), you can continue to pretend i am what you decieve yourself that i am.
    or better still, do the decent thing and apologize to matt

  • The Ruler 777

    I will loose respect for Arsene should we sign Suraez, and I LOVE Arsene, partly cause I always feel he does the right thing and is a ma n of principle. Signing Suraez sends the wrong message out completely. And my love for Arsenal will also be lost, I am very proud to be an Arsenal fan, the onnly club I have ever or could ever imagine supporting but I can’t SUPPORT that move or the club if indeed it is made. I love Arsenal deeply so I’m hoping and praying it doesn’t happen and it’s a smokescreen. Suraez is an absolute scumbag, his apoligists are make themselves look silly, the evidence is conclusive about this “person”. He’s a disgrace to football.