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Keeping them on for 90 minutes is the key

By Walter Broeckx

We all remember the days that Koscielny came to Arsenal. Well I do.  It was in 2010 and he was bought one year after Wenger had bought Vermaelen.  The moaners were up in arms.  Another unknown French guy.  Only one year top flight experience in France. Another example on how Wenger had lost it.

In his first game for Arsenal Koscielny did a good job. But he did get sent off in the final minute at Liverpool with two yellow cards. Welcome to the referees in the PL, Laurent. As an Arsenal player you get no free card to step over the line.

His worst moment came a bit later. In the final of the league cup. A mix up between him and Szczesny in the final minute leading to us losing that final. Hey we were competing in a final. Blimey, who could have thought that.

The critics were out in full force on him. And on Wenger as he has brought him in. This is a fine (in a way of speaking of course) example on how some football fans live and base their judgement on the last ball a player has touched. If it was a good one fine, but if he made a mistake he should be hung, drawn and quartered, and anything still living should then be  buried alive.

Many footballers would have called it a day and it would have been their last contribution to that team. I have seen fans demanding the immediate demotion of Koscielny to whatever team we could send him as long as he didn’t put on the shirt for the first team. Luckily we have a manager who is not that short sighted as some fans.

A manager that knows that every person makes mistakes and should be given new chances to redeem themselves. And I do admit that I feared a bit for Koscielny that he would go the way others have done in the past when being chosen to be the cheap scapegoat of some fans.  It took a big personality to overcome this. And in the end it maybe made him even more determined to prove the doubters from the first minute wrong.

The same could be said of Per Mertesacker. Needless to say that I almost jumped as high as Per is when I saw the official announcement of him becoming a real Gunner. Gooner he already was from his youth and I knew it was a special step for him.

Do you remember the same old moaners going on about him. Too slow, can’t jump, can’t run, in short he just was a big useless lump of German flesh that again that stubborn French (must mention this of course) ***t has bought.  It was a big step for Per. And we must remember that defending in the Bundesliga is done in a different way from defending in England. The game in the Bundesliga is more technical and less physical.

Defenders cannot go in like madmen in the Bundesliga and if they do, they will be standing under the shower before the 90 minutes are over. Strikers use their technical skills more to go past defender and not their brutal force. Something Per had to get used to.

And he also had to find out that unlike in the Bundesliga there is no protection for defenders when strikers commit fouls on defenders. And certainly not when you are a big German. In Germany refs blow the whistle on fouls against defenders, but in England they say: he has to be stronger. Which is nonsense when a foul is committed but that is just the way it goes.

But gradually the BFG showed what he really is. One of the best defenders from Germany and it was not a coincidence that he had so many caps for Germany. By now even the most critical fan must have seen how he uses his head and intelligence when defending. How he sometimes presses the striker to commit himself the way he likes it to do and he can block his pass or make a great interception or a block.

So we have now two centre backs who at the start of their Arsenal careers have been buried under the most vile criticism from some part of the fans. But the manager knew what he was doing and stubborn as he is, he ignored the know it all from the sidelines. Even the newspapers made “funny” headlines about Per at times. I think last year in November he silenced the last critics at Wembley.

The stats that could be found on arsenal.com the other day is like Per said himself, a bit unbelievable. Since January 2012 whenever they could both stay on the field for the full 90 minutes, Arsenal didn’t lose. That is more than 2 years!

So from going from two jokes of centre backs (according to you know who and the media) they now have shown what they are really made of. The faith the manager had in them has been rewarded. And of course yeah we at Untold who supported all our players and certainly when things were going against them feel a great joy about this great record.

We have stood by them when they made mistakes. We forgave them their mistakes and just asked them to do their best. Needless to say that they are just doing that. And even when one day this record will come to and end, like all records come to an end, we will still back them. Because we don’t forget all the good they have done all that time even when they make a mistake. That is not the Untold way of treating our players.

The only lesson they have to learn is that they must make sure they stay on the pitch together for 90 minutes. If they can do that (and we all know refs are quick to send them off) then the chance of us not losing is very big.

Per and Kos are just another fine example on how that our manager’s little finger knows more about football than the combined brains of all the non-existing you know who.

Books on Arsenal at a discount

64 comments to Keeping them on for 90 minutes is the key

  • WalterBroeckx

    If I may add one more thing about Per and this is another example on how this BFG is such a great person.

    After our win last week he tweeted this: “This win is yours @aaronramsey @JackWilshere Tomas Theo Kim! ”

    A nice message to the injured players. My God, how I love our BFG!

  • jambug

    Nice article Walter. Sounds like a great guy as well as a great player. He seems to be the Captain of this side in spirit, if not yet in name. Surely that is just a matter of time.

  • Mike

    Great article in every way. And, if I’m not mistaken, those same moaners were also the ones saying how Szczesny shouldn’t be allowed to wear the shirt again; and how Ramsey was another poor buy from AW; and how Giroud would never hack it in the premiership;. And I have no doubt that they would have called for a young Thierry to have been sold because he had a poor first season and couldn’t hit a barn door.

    What amazes me is that the AAA just keep coming back with the same old drivel time and time again irrespective of how many times they get proved wrong. No AW isn’t perfect, he’s human and makes mistakes like the rest of us (apart from the AAA’s of couse!) but he knows a hell of a lot more than the collective amateur offerings of ALL Arsenal supporters let alone the loud mouthed dissenting minority.

  • madawa

    Mike, it is a real nice article of the year to my opinion. A lot has been said by fans and even pudists about Per and Kosc, let a lone Rambo, syz,and even Giroud. But, thanks to Arsene for understanding that those rads have potentials to take the team forwad one day. The rads have proved that wenger was wright to keep belif in them. We are at the top, I hope the two guys P and k will prove that they are strong on saturday against SAS.

  • Brickfields Gunners

    As long as the players do their very best to keep the momentum going and continue to play as a unit , we should do well this season .
    As a supporter I will back the manager’s choices as AW does know best.
    Its always refreshing to see the team bonding and generally getting on well with each other ,best exemplified by their beaming smiles .

  • Brickfields Gunners

    This made me smile !

    A cat died and went to Heaven. God met her at the Pearly Gates, petted her on the head and said, “You have been a good cat for these 40 years. Anything that you want is yours for the asking.”
    The cat thought for a minute and replied, “All my life I have lived on a farm and slept on hard wooden floors. I would like a real fluffy pillow to sleep on.” God said, “Say no more.” Instantly the cat had a huge, fluffy pillow.
    A few days later, six mice were killed in an accident, and they all went to heaven together. God met them at the gates of Heaven with the same offer He made to the cat.
    The mice said, “Well, all our lives we’ve had to run from dogs, cats and even people with brooms. If we could just have some little roller skates, we’d never have to run again.” God said, “It is done!”
    All the mice had beautiful little roller skates. About a week later, God decided to check on the cat. He found her sound asleep on her fluffy pillow. God gently awakened the cat and asked, “Is everything okay? How you been doing? Are you happy?”
    The cat replied, “Oh, I’ve never been so happy in my life! My pillow is so fluffy, and those little meals-on-wheels you’ve been sending over here are delicious!

  • nicky

    The trouble is…..that sometimes these know-alls win and Arsene’s choice falls by the wayside.
    e.g. Denilson.

  • Armin

    There is whole list of boys who could make something from it if there were more patience. Freshest example Gervinho, Vela copes well in Spain, but as said know-alls sometime win.

  • nicky,

    No one ever called Arsene perfect but for every Denilson, there 3 or more Fabregas, Song & co. His batting average is arguably the best in the business when it comes when he gets it right versus when he doesn’t. Look at Armin’s comment below yours for the other side of the argument.

  • Have always believe that in every person there is always a golden mind but only those who won’t mind dipping there hands in dirty soil nd water will get it. I read nt long ago about how Robert Pires was treated when he 1st came to Arsenal, he said He felt the Fans are cold towards him but wit the happy of AW he over come it nd He’s no sitting comfortably in the Legend chairs.The love of we Fans can drive even the most Average players to Stardom.
    Sorry of Topic, I read that westham are planning to get a lawyer to defend Carol of his latest Red card.

  • SouthernGunner

    Two fine players that we’re lucky to have in the red & white. It’s remarkable how well they’ve grown into the footballers they are since arriving. Credit to the manager for believing in them. Just wish there was a way to accomodate Vermaelen too, who is also very good. And credit to him for his professionalism & conduct.

    This is probably the best group of centrebacks we’ve had for a long time.

  • soglorious

    Nicky, tell me you’ve never made a mistake in your life. and as Boo said, to every denilson there are other gervinhos who are performing better now in a club with more responsible fans than some of ours. There is no doubt about the fact that Wenger Knows Best than anyone else when it comes to issues regarding Arsenal.
    Nice article Walter, to remind our holier-than-thou fans that every man should be given a little patience.
    seems to me A. Wenger reads Untold cos today he just repeated – word for word – what was said on here about Giroud performing better in his second year when he was transferred. can’t remember the article now.

  • Ugandan Goon

    @nicky,bootoomee
    I had stopped commenting on this site because of trolls, but i feel if even after reading the article, two of the most clubble and social animals around cannot help thev sort off the cuff comments that perpetuate the lie that the players who’ve served our club were poor,something really has to be said:
    Do you know people who say “i don’t mind if players have an off day, as long as they give 100% for the shirt” W T F is an off day to you?,(my definition of an off day is poor performance in relation to potential, 100%? fuck off!)
    similarly, ignoring the good that people have done to highlight the bad, is a depressing fact of the human condition, and unfortunately no secret to those who prey on the human spirit, Be on your Guard, Gentlemen!

  • TJ

    In the current context and where we are, I think Per has been AW’s greatest defensive signing ever. The man is a class act, a leader of men by example and seems so down to earth also. I would love to see him made club captain.

  • Ugandan Goon

    @ nicky, bootoomee,
    I Apolgize unreservedly, i think i got that wrong, sorry!

  • tshirt

    errm the BFG is such an intelligent player,i see his interceptions and runs off the ball,
    i was discussing with an arsenal friend and he told me,do you know why we lost against man chesthair urinated? i said no,
    he said it was because merts was absent,and i recalled that cheeky nod from the man with a little boy inside,but you know that cross wouldn’t have gone in if merts was around.

    who dares play below par when merts is around? as for me i would rather play/defend well than face a yelling from him.

  • colario

    The commentators, the sports writers, the former players of other teams and sometimes (sadly) former Arsenal players and all others who know football better than Arsene. (Europe’s top manager) They have been telling us for years ‘Arsene doesn’t do defense.’

    So who brought Koscielny and Mertesacker?

    So we conclude that what all these ‘football experts’ know about football is zilch, nothing.

    After all these years of Arsene not doing what they told to do but doing better you would think they might begin to realise that Arsene knows.

    With regard to ‘brains in little finger’ Not a good one in my opinion for the natural reply is:
    ‘Well at least I keep my brains in my head and not my little finger!’ Bom! Bom!

  • nicky

    The point that seems to be missed about Denilson is that his failure was largely due to the abuse freely directed at him by those at the Emirates, who thought they knew better than Arsene.
    Remember too that Aaron Ramsey could have easily gone the Denilson way.

  • TommieGun

    @ Ugandan – as being (one) person who at least said something similar, to what you went against, I’ll say –

    1. I don’t care if someone has an off day means that they missed a few good chances for a striker, or made a defensive mistake that cost us a goal, for a defender or goalie. It has nothing to do with potential, it has everything to do with results. Sometimes you can work your ass off, and still miss a sitter or make a poor clearance. That’s an off day. Hope you understand.

    2. Not giving 100% is trickier to explain, but very easy to spot when you are in the stadium, and sometimes even on TV. It’s not tracking back, it’s not fighting for the 50-50s, it’s not going into that sliding-near-post goal chance; it’s not running your socks off. I am sure you know what I mean.

    I hope I made myself clear (if any clarification was required)

  • TommieGun,

    I cannot agree with you more on point 2. It’s why I love Ollie so much and I cannot stand people who insult him just because he doesn’t score as many goals as Suarez or Aguero.

  • para

    First let me say, i am not putting this article down in any way, i like to philosophise.

    I have realised that all things seem to interact in this universe. Every individual’s or community’s act does cause some effect in multiple places.

    I quote you: “And in the end it maybe made him even more determined to prove the doubters from the first minute wrong.”
    Think about it, maybe it was exactly the doubters that allowed us to have the Kos we have today.
    Everything seems, at least to me, to have some effect and influence on us all.
    Maybe i’m going too far, but i can’t help it.

  • Gord

    @Brickfields

    That cartoon would never be part of my life. Autism has made me hopeless at dating and jobsearch.

    On the topic of places further north than I am (no Eskimo or Inuit nearby), I was reading something about places on the Arctic coast, and one of them was apparently known for especially good fermented whale blubber. I know there are some sausages that are fermented, but I can’t imagine just fat on its own getting fermented. Must be more to the recipe.

  • Gord

    From the BBC.

    The Football page shows us that West Ham is dissatisfied with not getting Carroll’s red card overturned, they are seeking legal redress now.

    Lawro’s predictions are out. He is pitted against You Me At Six’s Josh Franceschi. Who I wouldn’t know from a hole in the ground. Hopefully he doesn’t get as stupid as that damned beaver from Canada. 🙂

    Apparently Josh is a Gooner, and is predicting a 2-1 win for us. Lawro, well we all know what Lawro is.

    COYG!

  • Damilare

    Another nice one there Walter. But please let no one suggest ‘captaincy’ to BFG now. I may be wrong but I dont like what has been happening to our captains since Thierry Henry the XIV.

    Im happy to read the 1st Oct 1996 story of AW (other article). I now know why the media hated him so much. They won’t stop until they discover how foolish they have been. So we don’t need to tell them. That time is nearer than ever.

    Our defence had made SAS look very ordinary once this season, Im sure they will do it again on Saturday.

    COYG.

  • Mandy Dodd

    Per and kos are right up amongst the best in the world. TV is not bad either. The current media wankfest is over Terry and Cahill, will take our players any day.
    Wenger , the man who knows nothing of defence deserves huge credit for these two, and for that matter our whole defence. The AAA / media wanted samba, hangerland, Taylor from Newcastle….good calls guys!
    As you say, just hope they play the full game this weekend and that we are not given a ref that may succumb to the less pleasant antics of Suarez. I will fear the worst here in such a game.
    Mention of players the AAA would have got rid of…..gervinho got another brace this week. He is becoming the player wenger….and Eden hazard thought he was. With the injuries this year, such a player would have been useful, for him not being around to help us, we have to thank the guardians of our club, the AAA, who would also have rid us of Ramsey Walcott….and many others. Thanks AAA

  • Ugandan Goon

    @Tommie Gun,
    love that you find these two bits of ‘punditese’ difficult to explain or even tell apart, because that was my point.
    People rate players’ performances on very little evidence, i have had arguments with people who were slating Ramsey / Wenger, when he had to play and stick to the right flank to protect Jenkinson who was covering for Sagna. “why is wenger playing him out of position?”
    Rate him on the job he’s been asked to do if you know what that is, the manager’s post match interview is full of these little nuggets of insight, but very rarely is he questioned to elicit them and usually he has to hold some cards close to his chest so i agree we are working with very limited information and judgements have to be made superficially.
    A recent example of this was the Southampton away match, where it was generally agreed we had a poor first half, i remember thinking we just could’nt catch a break for toffee, the 50-50 ball just seemed to wanna bounce to a southampton player, the first goal where there was a clear foul on Monreal, everyone blamed the defender’s starting position disregarding this was from open play, as if J.fonte (whose younger brother Rui, was on our books for a while) could’nt have shoved him to the floor anyway. Off day or less than 100%, for the ref, lino certainly.
    Ozil’s behaviour and performances seem to have rubbed a few people the wrong way this season, i think these sort of people would rather have a scott parker or a holtby charging around the centre circle like a demented terrier, the sublime talents of ozil/bergkamp are like pearls before swine.
    In conclusion, whilst i think i know what people mean, i reject it as too simplistic, and assert there have been very few opportunities where it would be fair to level that any of our players.

  • Russell

    Anyone see the interview with Dermott Gallagher recently? He says fergie tried to get him to postpone a match to better their chances of winning the league.

  • Mandy Dodd

    DG saying such things is quite amazing, I always had him down as a mouthpiece and attack dog for Riley…..how things change

  • Andrew Crawshaw

    There is an excellent comparison between Per/Kos and terry/Cahill in today’s post on 7AM Kickoff. Well worth checking out. The two pairings have different strengths but are statistically equivalent, not that the “unbiased” UK media will ever acknowledge it. I’m with Tim in preferring ours. COYG

  • Ugandan Goon

    @Gord,
    The MOTD highlights show clearly that although Carroll was fouled first he reacted violently twice in that little passage, and even better catch the players facial expression as he commits the fouls (admittedly if i were the ref,i would have done the big lump for intent or doctored my report to pretend that’s what i saw.)
    Now, the pundits and commentator acted as if the swansea player were somehow the culprit, even with the benefit of replays, they are responsible for the impression most viewers left with.
    If it’s fine for Carroll to be deployed as a human battering ram by allardyce, then other forms of gamesmanship should not be villified any more or less.
    They are both cheats, one Englsh, the other foreign- It always makes me guffaw when english steel comes up against the rules of football, Man U – Barca is favourite.

  • Gord

    @Ugandan Goon

    As the day has developed, my guess is that the reason for pursuing legal channels, is to allow Carroll to continue playing until a resolution happens. Which may at some point result in a suspension longer than what was originally applied. I suspect his because I believe West Ham is trying to overtake us in the injury department. 🙂 If Carroll gets suspended, he might not have forwards available. But, I am just guessing.

    Thanks for your views.

  • bjtgooner

    @Mandy

    DG is still employed by Sky to “explain” ref decisions and in consequence to cover up for the PGMOL . I didn’t see the recent interview but did see the subsequent report. Looks like the fear factor re Fergie has been removed, otherwise DG would not have given the interview. What else has yet to be revealed and why has our illustrious press not investigated DG’s comments further?

  • Gord

    OT: The exodus begins at ManU

    The BBC is reporting that Vidic is leaving ManU at the end of the season, and will not renew his contract. I would guess this has something to do with no more Champions League.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26078800

    It could be because he is over 30. I suspect if ManU was in the top 3 at this point, he would renew. That they may struggle to even get top-4 is probably part of the reason.

  • Micheal Ram

    I have noticed in many games that how per and kos exchange positions to suit the marking perspective. For the opponents there is no such things as isolate per/kos or attack per/kos side of defense or even exploit per’s pace or kos’ s height ( kos is freakingly difficult to beat in the air anyways). In general, their personal attributes are making of this efficient partnership. Not to exaggerate, they remind me of maldini and nesta partnership at milan’s peak. Kos is a physical specimen like nesta and per is a general like maldni. Both are humble, unselfish and down to earth like them too. Not to mention, they are highly skillful and well respected as well. Thank wengerness, we didnt buy clowns like cahill or hangeland when some idiots hurried for. Howver, a lot of us forget to mention our captain in his role of making this happen. Credit to vermaelen for pushing the duo to the limits. Brought a new level of competition and although he is clearly a better player individually, clearly accepts that team comes first. Respect his professionalism and unselfishness. Hope Arsenal win titles this year and let Vermaelen lift the trophy. Im sure all Arsenal players would want that too. I know I do.

  • ARSENAL 13

    @nicky..

    “The point that seems to be missed about Denilson is that his failure was largely due to the abuse freely directed at him by those at the Emirates, who thought they knew better than Arsene.
    Remember too that Aaron Ramsey could have easily gone the Denilson way.”

    And Cesc. I feel this was precisely the reason why Cesc departed early. I always felt Cescs shoulder dropped when things were not going his way. Who knows, had he stayed a bit longer he would have been the target too…..

    Long back we had a topic on “BRITISH SPINE”. I dont know what people mean by that but as per me, its about the grit, determination and mental resolve to fight against the circumstances. Per, Koscielny and Ramsey have shown that it exists. This squad has shown that it exists….

  • Persian Gunner

    Per’s comments about Thomas were sensational!
    Calling him our Captain, always high him up by his influence even off the pitch…
    This shows BFG is the personality the game missed for years
    Also shows how this team is so united and ready to work together for success
    Proud to be be a gunner to support such a Manager and players

  • nicky

    @Arsenal 13,
    If there is ever an example of your “British Spine” it’s Aaron Ramsey.

  • Brickfields Gunners

    Hope you’re able to view this clip titled Martin -“You raise me up “.
    A flash mob of one !

    https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B_ruStQGpT38M3JVdnZGUE81dDA/edit

    “You Raise Me Up”
    When I am down and, oh my soul, so weary;
    When troubles come and my heart burdened be;
    Then, I am still and wait here in the silence,
    Until you come and sit awhile with me.

    You raise me up, so I can stand on mountains;
    You raise me up, to walk on stormy seas;
    I am strong, when I am on your shoulders;
    You raise me up… To more than I can be.

    You raise me up, so I can stand on mountains;
    You raise me up, to walk on stormy seas;
    I am strong, when I am on your shoulders;
    You raise me up… To more than I can be.

    There is no life – no life without its hunger;
    Each restless heart beats so imperfectly;
    But when you come and I am filled with wonder,
    Sometimes, I think I glimpse eternity.

    You raise me up, so I can stand on mountains;
    You raise me up, to walk on stormy seas;
    I am strong, when I am on your shoulders;
    You raise me up… To more than I can be.

    You raise me up, so I can stand on mountains;
    You raise me up, to walk on stormy seas;
    I am strong, when I am on your shoulders;
    You raise me up… To more than I can be.

    You raise me up… To more than I can be.

  • Brickfields Gunners

    Martin You raise me up

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RojlDwD07I

  • WalterBroeckx

    Brickfields,

    What an amazing coincidence. Yesterday evening I was sitting with my wife watching TV and they gave a program called ‘Holland got talent’ (it’s probably on in each country around the globe) a kind of flash back over the years before a new season starts.
    And there was this Martin fellow. He had worked for 32 years as a baker but got unemployed. His daughters called him Paparotti for his beautiful voice and insisted that he should participate to the show. At the end he won the final.
    The first time he came on he sang Nessun Dorma made world famous by Pavarotti. Amazing voice.

    And now you post a link to him….it’s a strange world

  • Menace

    TV, our bench warmer while Per & Kos perform. His alternative position is Center Forward. He is made for the position. He can head, hold the ball and has sufficient to put the ball past any keeper.

    Wenger will surprise us with this soon.

  • jambug

    @ Mandy Dodd 9.04

    What you say about the AAA types driving Gervinho out, as well as there attempts at others, is very true.

    So often we get it in the neck from the AAA’s saying ‘they’re entitled to there opinion’ ”we’re only telling it like it is’ Yada Yada Yada !!!

    But that’s not the point. Of course every one is. But they do more, much much more than just ‘express a view’.

    I moan about players. I moan about Wenger.

    As we on here so often say, we know they’re not perfect.

    But having a moan is a million miles from what the AAA’s do. Things like:

    Setting up Wenger/The board out web sites.

    Actively encouraging Wenger/The board out protests.

    Targeting players, THEY have decide aren’t good enough, with disgraceful written and verbal insults.

    Setting out to thoroughly undermine the entire structure of the Club.

    Actively feeding the anti Arsenal media with there bile.

    All this is WAY WAY beyond just being ‘Entitled to there opinion’

    I truly believe the AAA types activities have hindered our progress to a massive degree.

    And you know what the saddest thing about that statement is….they’d be proud of it.

    They are an embarrassment to the Club and all our decent loyal fans.

    In fact they are a F**king disgrace !!!

  • TJ

    Jambug

    While I agree with you that any form of abuse directed at a player when playing is disgraceful, Gervinho would seem to have an alternative theory.

    http://www.football-italia.net/39265/gervinho-blames-wenger

  • jambug

    TJ

    Well that surprises me. But if he thinks that and that’s what he said what can I say, but it does surprise me because I do recall reading an article in which Wenger was lamenting the departure of Gervinho and he cited the undermining of his confidence by the treatment he received from some sections of the crowd as a major contributor as to why he left.

    I see the article says “……he told SUNSPORT”

    Hmmm..not saying Gervinho didn’t say it but personally I don’t believe the date on the SUN.

    You might put more stock in the journalistic credentials. Each to there own.

    Seems to be 2 completely conflicting understanding as to what was going on !

    Whatever, it doesn’t change the broader points of my post though.

  • TJ

    Ok Jambug

    I don’t believe a word I see in the Press unless I see quotation marks. He also told Sports Illustrated, here you go

    http://www.voice-online.co.uk/article/gervinho-rips-arsene-wenger-and-gunners

    And I agree- it does not change the broader points- all of which I agree with (except for the concept of an organised AAA and the idea that an Arsenal fan would consciously attempt undermine the entire structure of the Club)

  • jambug

    TJ

    Well sadly I’m afraid I think they do.

    We’ll have to agree to disagree.

  • jambug & TJ,

    We can compare Gervinho and Chamakh (have always struggled with that spelling but y’all know who I’m talkkng about). The latter blamed no one for his travails at Arsenal despite having less opportunities than the former. With what I saw when Gervinho wore our shirt, he was more to blame than anyone else. I have never entirely bought the “fans made him lose his confidence” line to be honest and while I NEVER booed or maligned him when he played for us, I was never convinced of his ability either.

    My biggest issue with him was his ball control and composure in front of goal. I find it laughable that he complained about not being given the striking role by Arsene. Say what you may about Giroud but he is a sharp-shooter compared to Gervinho. He was great for us at taking on defenders but his final ball was nothing but infuriating. I’m happy that he is doing great at his new club but I personally blame no one but Gervinho for his failings at Arsenal.

    Now, when you talk about his compatriot, Eboue, that is a player who was hounded out of the club by the fans. I still miss Eboue. He is a genuinely good guy who was (and ironically, still is) very loyal to the club and always gave his best in whatever position he was played.

    Gervinho’s claim is nothing but blaming others for his own failings. He needs to take a cue from Chamakh, another player whose career has picked up since he left us, and take responsibility for his inadequacies.

  • Oh, by the way, Gervinho can’t really have digs at Arsenal. He might be scoring for his current club but our own players are scoring for us too but most importantly, since he left us, we’ve topped the league in 18 out of 24 games. We could also say that since he left us, we’ve been doing much better and insinuate that he might have been the one holding us back!

  • jambug

    Bootoomee.

    Good points you make as usual but the one I want to pick up on most is with regards to Eboue.

    The way some of our ‘supposed’ fans treated him was nothing short of shameful. I still have other fans throwing it in my face and what can I do but look ashamed embarrassed. Because I am.

  • jambug,

    Me and you both bro. It was one of the most shameful episodes of the Wenger era. Eboue’s treatment was appalling to say the least. And yes, the fans are to blame. But it says something about Eboue’s personality that he remains loyal and kind to the club in all his interviews since he left us.

    I am proud to say that I was at the Emirates cup against Galatasaray and among the many who gave the guy all the love we could. I love that guy and I miss him.

  • Ugandan Goon

    @Bootoomee,
    Sorry Buddy, but if anyone is going to troll me it is someone having a pop at Gervinho, if you are going to have a pop, be as accurate and as fair as possible, I dont think many people really appreciate two of his best assets, movement and instinctive dribbling, and just like Ozil, this stuff seems to pass under the Radar if there is no goal at the end of it.
    He rejoined his manager at lille,and like every honest soul he explained why he’d flopped at arsenal, the fact that it appears under that shitty headline in a rag not even useful as toilet paper prejudices you against the player, if you really wanted to be fair you might read this too, esp confidence lacking at Ems,
    http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/wenger-why-i-let-gervinho-leave
    and this is why i get hopping mad when reasonable people say things about the players wearing our shirt casually not intending to hurt but it is the deepest cut because it is betrayal, it is so unthoughtful.

  • jambug

    Here here to that boo.

  • TJ

    I agree Bootoomee- I was absolutely disgusted with what happened to Eboue who was not only a good squad player but by all accounts a good personality to have in the squad.

    With Gervinho- it’s a shame. You could see how talented he was, he just always looked timid and nervous. I would have loved to have seen him stay and prove the boo boys wrong, alas. I’d rather have Giroud though.

  • Ugandan Goon,

    I don’t quite get your commenting style but I’ll try my best to respond. I have difficulty understanding your disagreement(s) with my comment. State what you disagree with and back it with evidence if possible.

    Like I wrote above, I never abused or maligned Gervinho while he played for us. Yes, I am ok with saying so in non-abusive manner when he player has a poor game but I have never participated in campaign of calumny against any of our players.

    Having said that, Gervinho’s control and composure in the opposition goal area was atrocious for Arsenal. I don’t even think that that statement is controversial at all.

    Concerning the link that you provided, that was quintessential Arsene. He NEVER runs any of his players down; past or present. I don’t just love AW because he is a great manager for the club that I support. I love Arsene because of those kind of link you provided. Arsene Wenger is a magnanimous soul and a great human being.

    I stand by my comment on Gervinho.

  • Gord

    Sorry, another OT:

    Saturday, Feb 22 (Sunderland) there is another statue being unveiled.

    http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/date-set-for-bergkamp-statue-unveiling

  • TJ,

    Thanks for the link. Our BFG is phenomenal!

  • jambug

    TJ

    The mans immense.

  • Gord

    Thanks TJ. It’s kind of neat the Per’s brother sometimes travels with the fans to away games.

  • WalterBroeckx

    OMG, I will be there in London for that match… I will be there…I WILL BE THERE!!!!

    Sorry my excitement got the better of me 😉

  • Gord

    Congratulations Walter!

    I hope many others from Untold can make it, like Tony for example.

  • Gord

    I wonder if Mannone likes Bergkamp?

  • Ugandan Goon

    Hey bootoomee,
    The reasaon i was ticked off is because i felt there was a bit of confirmation bias, the Papers have no obligation to be fair (or even accurate) to AFC, the fact that a player did’nt quite fulfill his potential with us owes a lot to factors either beyond their understanding or not polemical enough to attract hits, the reason i put up the Wenger interview was to show that both manager and player were in agreement about one thing, it was down to confidence, which the manager then goes to explain is crucial for that kind of player to excel, he also nuanced that the fans, crucially the home crowd were less than supportive of the player, knocking his confidence and essentially working against our interest.
    I have been to the Ems when the Boo boys have gone into overdrive,there is nothing more ugly!
    But on the flip side, i have been less than complementary about Stuart Robson in the past, and i cannot promise fair play in the future, so yet again here i stand cap in hand, APOLOGIZING.

  • Nelson Wong

    Speaking of Koscielny and him taking time to develop, I think Wenger known in those years that he needs a few years to work with these guys before he can really get very good results. Given the financial constraints, he could not buy “ready to use” players so he prepared for worse results. Of course, he could not come out and tell the fans so he kept saying things are fine and good where as Wenger, and the board, dug trenches and prepared for some hard years. The only bad thing he did was to over extend himself in trophies. If Wenger employed a more pragmatic approach on CL and concentrate on FA cup, league cup and so on, the team would have gotten one trophies.

    As for Per, the only think I wanna say is : “Why didn’t Wenger get him earlier.” The team would be in better shape if Per joined earlier but still transfers are tricky and Wenger can’t keep piling up players.

    The funniest thing I remember was people talking about BFG can’t do headers even though he is so tall. That sounded very weird and is certainly wrong as we can see now. The only real issue of Per is his speed but there are plenty of quick guys at Arsenal to cover for that. What the team lacked was someone who can deal with header and organize those young guys and that is what Per was signed to do.

    Per and Giroud, together with effective drills are stopping all those goals conceded in set pieces. Once a while he actually score a goal or assist through headers.