By Tony Attwood
- The Champions League – where will each time end up?
- The real danger facing Arsenal is not Michael Oliver, it is PGMO, and here is why
So Arsenal have won their appeal against Myles Lewis-Skelly’s red card given in the West Midlands.
That might sound like a victory for Arsenal but it is an utter defeat for football, not least because there is no sign of an investigation into either how referee Michael Oliver came to make such a wrong decision, and much, much, much more important, how the referee VAR committee upheld the decision.
And we must note that the appeals group and the PGMO Referee VAR Group both saw exactly the same evidence. So how come the PGMO group could view that evidence and back up the referee’s decision? (And this is important – this is not like a court of appeal in the legal world where new evidence can be put and historic cases cited – this is just looking at a video).
The fact that the referee can make a mistake should not come as any surprise – we can all make mistakes. But as we now know, the VAR group looking at the evidence saw exactly the same evidence and reversed the decision. And the remaining question (“How could the VAR referees get it so wrong?”) has not even been considered for a second.
As ever, “why?” is the biggest question. Why the referee made a mistake is easy to answer – it happens, he views it in an instant, and in such circumstances, some errors are bound to occur. But the VAR referees had as much time as they wanted, and that is where the real worry lies because the most obvious implication here is that they either were not looking properly or else that they wanted Arsenal to be harmed by losing a player.
The only other explanation is that they are not doing their job properly and are simply there to give credence to what the referee says. And neither view says anything good about PGMO.
This is of course very serious. Whether the Ref VAR system is a shame or not, it did not do its duty, and asking why remains a vital question, and one that is currently being ignored by the PGMO supporting media..
A key element here is the fact that as ESPN have pointed out,” only one red card has been overturned through VAR this season, when the referee wrongly thought West Ham United’s Guido Rodríguez had caught Southampton’s Kyle Walker-Peters with studs on shin when stretching into a challenge: It was a clear example of the official describing something different to the video evidence, as Rodríguez made only a small amount of contact on the toe of Walker-Peters’ boot.”
And this gives us a clue. Oliver reported to VAR that the card was given for the initial contact being above the ankle. And that is what VAR therefore had to look for, nothing else. So in fact the referee’s VAR was utterly useless because the referee who makes the decision was able to direct the Ref VAR to one specific issue, not allowing it the right to consider anything else. As the report says, the freeze frame images that the VAR team look at “remove all the context of force and intensity.”
In short, Ref VAR is utterly useless in situations like this. But it is promoted by PGMO as being an excellent safety valve – when it is nothing of the sort. And it is not just useless it is worse than that because it gives the impression of independent validation when it is not. Had everyone not made a big fuss, the VAR would have stood and the wrong decision reached.
In such circumstances, PGMO has a history of continuing to claim they are right and everyone else is wrong. However, the decision against PGMO does not show just that on this occasion the PGMO and the VAR were wrong. It shows the whole system is utterly unfit for purpose.
Of course, much also depends on who is on the appeal panel – there are always one or two players, but are they attackers or defenders? That will affect the result as much as anything else.
So here we are with a highly secretive PGMO that never answers issues in public and doesn’t even have a website, defending itself in the face of overwhelming commentaries that the decision was wrong, and citing its own VAR version of events. Its ruling has been overturned but nothing in the system has changed and no one is asking how PGMO can be stopped from errors such as this in the future.
As ever, PGMO is shown to be inadequate, it makes no offer to change its way, it carries on regardless, and the media does not raise a single question.
Just read on another site that the chief football writer on Sky stated that everything is ok re the MLS sending off because of the appeal came to a quick decision . No mention there whole organisation backed the referee and VAR , took down tweets and tried to change the concept of the sending off . I totally agree with your article Tony
“But as we now know, the VAR group looking at the evidence saw exactly the same evidence and reversed the decision. And the remaining question (“How could the VAR referees get it so wrong?”) has not even been considered for a second”.
According to The Mirror the other day this is PGMOL justification as to why VAR didn’t intervene:
“….the Northumberland-born referee followed the correct protocol and provided an accurate (I repeat ACCURATE) description of the incident to the VAR team. Darren England”
As we could all see from the various replays, as could VAR, as could the panel, Olivers description of what happened was utterly inaccurate.
As poor as his decision is, and as premeditated as I think it is, I can just about accept it as a genuine mistake being made in real time. As you say Tony, we all make mistakes.
As such I agree with your conclusion that “…much, much, much more important, is how the referee VAR committee upheld the decision”
It was a clear and obvious mistake.
And lets not forget, despite the surprise assessment from Gallagher, at the time SKY ‘smatch day ‘refereeing expert” Mike ‘dancing’ Dean, bent over backwards to find a way to defend Olivers AND worse, VAR’s decisions.
Why did he do that? He took ONE STILL PHOTOGRAPH as the definitive view. The ONE photograph that suited what he wanted to see.
And that folks is the problem with referees, VAR and their puppets in the SKY studio:
THEY SEE WHAT THEY WANT TO SEE NOT THE TRUTH.
I fear for the next weeks where we might see an attempt of revenge from the PGMO…. or… just business as usual in a way….
The operation of VAR should be removed from PGMOL, as there have been numerous incidents of its use to back-up referees, rather than to offer independent and objective advice. (eg Dean admitting to a wrong call in order to protect his mate the referee).
I also don’t allow that this was a simple human error by Oliver, since he has such a well-documented history of trying to cheat Arsenal. This incident appears to have been a pre-meditated stitch-up between him and VAR.
Dean and Gallagher are disgraceful commentators, but Webb is the real culprit responsible for this corrupt outfit.
John L
As with most issues the problems start at the top, in this case with the PGMOL and it’s incompetent leader, Webb.
Webb admitting Oliver made a conscious decision to not send a player off because he didn’t want to spoil the game, when in the very next breath he defends ridiculously soft yellow cards because he ‘had no choice, by the letter of the law’.
When you have this pathetic double talk from the man in charge of our referees, how the f**k is it ever going to work?
Nitram @ 10.32
Is it that Webb can’t remember what he says from 1 week to the next or is it f##k you lot we do what we do and no one has questioned us , not even the FA who employ them and who’s product they are ruining at a fast pace .
I have seen it claimed on a few sites that the social media death threats to Oliver were as a result of the Arsenal fan fury coming after the MLS sending off. Apparently the police investigations into the inexcusable social media death threats sent to Oliver and his family actually came about after the Man U/Liverpool match a couple of weeks ago, nothing to do with the MLS debacle. Were PGMOL and their media pals deliberately trying to deflect attention away from themselves by manipulating the truth. No, surely not, that could never happen!
If you go to The Football Terrace you can get more info. Untold will not let me post a link to the You Tube clip so just search for …..
‘Arsenal CHEATED AGAIN?! PGMOL Under Fire & BBC’s Man Utd LIE REVEALED’
Mick Shelly
Thanks for that, I hadn’t seen it yet. I do pop into his blog now and then because he’s pretty fair. Obviously I don’t agree with everything he has to say, (That would be just weird) but given he’s a Man Utd fan, he is way more understanding and aligned with some of Untolds ideas than many Arsenal fans are.
What he says about Arsenal fans, that we shouldn’t make this all about is a fair point, and Untold Doesn’t. But as Arsenal fans obviously we are all over these numbers, and have been for years, and yes others do get bad calls, our referees are crap after all, but I still maintain we get worse treatment than most, if not all other clubs.
He freely admits their appears to be a media agenda against Arsenal. He has said this many times.
He then goes on to show a clip from Talksport that demonstrates this bias perfectly. Not only the bias against Arsenal, but the complete refusal of some to even consider for one moment there might be something wrong.
Jorden points out the enormous disparity in the amount of red cards we get compared to others. White shuts this debate down immediately with “because they are ALL red cards”. ALL. I’ll come back to that.
Not even a concession he might be wrong. No concession that they are all subjective decisions and therefor it is just his opinion they are ALL red cards. No concession that red or not it’s the fact that the rules are not applied consistently. No context. Nothing.
As TFT says, most Arsenal fans accept that in a subjective World, some people, and that obviously includes the referees, VAR and Jim White, will see every one as a red card. But also in a subjective World some will see NONE of them as a red (or second yellow of course).
But it’s back to the old chestnut of, when so many subjective calls go against one team whilst the same or very similar subjective calls don’t go against others, that surely questions need to be asked. Some, such as this White character obviously think not.
But it was very telling how White was so predisposed to dismissing Jorden’s point that he said instantly:
“Because they are ALL red cards”.
Except they weren’t were they White? In case you missed it, LMS’s red card just got rescinded. As the show was about that you would of thought even a Talksport presenter had a better memory than a Goldfish. It appears not.
Nitram
White never has a good word to say about Arsenal, like a long list of Talk Sport presenters. Durham, Andy Goldstein, White, Andy Jacobs, Cundy, O’hara to name but a few. There are so many it must be in their job description.
But this afternoon Andy Jacobs who has on many occasion said on air that he hates Arsenal, in reply to a caller who said you couldn’t blame Arsenal fans for feeling as though there was a bias of some kind against them considering the string of bad decisions so far this season Jacobs said “it’s Arsenals own fault”. According to Jacobs we have brought it on ourselves because of our excessive use of the dark arts and the refs are fed up with it.
How do these idiots manage to hold down their jobs on national radio when they are clearly lacking in any intelligence whatsoever.
Mick Shelly
The thing is, in his hatred for Arsenal he has actually admitted there is a bias against Arsenal. He didn’t even deny that we have faced a “string of bad decisions so far this season”.
This is significant:
Andy Jacobs of Talksport is actually admitting there is a refereeing biased against Arsenal!!
The fact he tries to justify it by suggesting the referees “are fed up with us.” is actually laughable, and completely irrelevant. Unless of course he’s suggesting it’s okay for referees to cheat simply because they don’t like how Arsenal play.
Would it be okay for refs to cheat Stoke because they don’t like how they play. Or to favour Spurs because they do like how they play?
What a w*****
Either way, it doesn’t change the fact that Talksport have finally conceded, on air, that the referees are biased against Arsenal. I’ll take that.
Nitram
I don’t know if you watch Mark Goldbridge on You Tube but he is another blogger who is not afraid to say what he (and us!) think of PGMOL.
He doesn’t pull any punches.
Search for……. Mark Goldbridge WE WON
There seems to be a growing number of non mainstream media bloggers not afraid to take up arms in the battle to expose these charlatans in the PGMOB and media.
It’s nice to know that Untold has some allies.
Watching on TNT anyone remember the Inter penalty ?
@Mick Shelley
“There seems to be a growing number of non-mainstream media bloggers not afraid to take up arms in the battle to expose these charlatans in the PGMOB and media.”
This seems to be true in all media matters, and not just those relating to football.
seismic
It does seem as if a lot of these blogs are picking up on these issues, but I still think we have a way to go in convincing people that despite ALL teams suffering, there is without doubt a bias against Arsenal beyond anyone else. TFT are pretty fair, but he was still trying to infer that Arsenal fans have to be careful not to make it all about them, which is fair, but that being said he needs to acknowledge that statistics are screwed against us more than anyone.
These red card stats are bad. Not only with Oliver but across the board. But it’s not only cards is it? Take a look at these penalty stats for the last 5 and a half seasons:
Team – Pens For – Pens Against – Differential
Arsenal – 33 -27 – Plus 6
Liverpool – 37 – 14 – Plus 23
Man City – 51 – 22 – Plus 27
That difference is insane.
It is simply impossible to explain away those statistics without concluding there is at the very least some kind of bias against Arsenal.
So no, it’s not all about us, but come on The Football terrace, explain that if you can?