The search to see exactly how Özil was injured and who was responsible.

By Walter Broeckx

First let me say I am not a doctor. But I am a person who likes to know how things come about. And so whenever I got an injury myself from doing sports I wanted to know from my doctors the how, why, what, where from it. And kept it in mind. Of course it might be that my doctors have given me wrong information. But as I have more or less recovered from my injuries I tend to believe them and think that they knew what they were talking about.

Apart from that I do have some good sources where I can get some relevant medical information. My oldest son is a veterinarian and his wife is a doctor. So if I have any medical question I can pick up my phone or just talk to them when they visit and I can get all the answers I need.  And I use these sources whenever I need them.

When my latest article about injuries and referees was published a few doubted that the kicking (mostly unpunished)  had much to do with our injuries.  They want to put the blame on the manager’s door.

I gave the example of Walcott and his knee and people said: no, there was no contact. I gave the example of Debuchy and people said: there was no contact. No, not really at the moment the injury became visible. But prior to that both had been the victim of severe kicks and fouls. And some of those fouls were not recognised by the referees. Come to think of it and this is a disappointing  thought for me…. that in both these matches the referee was Clattenburg. A ref I counted to be one of the better referees in the PL. And yet it was he who allowed those dangerous tackles and kicks leading directly to the injuries of those players.

If we go back to the Walcott injury he got kicked at his Achilles minutes before his knee finally gave way and his ACL was ruptured.  Now you might say: how can a kick on the Achilles lead to a knee injury? To understand this you have to look and think deeper than the outside of the body.

If we look at the broken leg of Eduardo it is simple. You get what you see. A lunge at ankle height and there goes the ankle to the left and there you can find the rest of the body to the right. That is so simple because you see the impact and the final result in an instant. Even a blind man can see it you could say. Or even man who are blinded can see it.

But this is not always the case. Sometimes you have impact on a body and the injury occurs somewhere else. Let me give you an example of this. A boxer is hit on the chin. He has no injury on the chin but he goes down to the floor and is unconscious and suffers brain damage. We all have heard of such things. But why are his brains hurt? After all he was hit on the chin and there is still some distance between both parts of the body.

This is because you have an impact zone (chin) and then the force from the impact is transferred in to the body and it has to find a place where the forces can find a place to end. And those forces usually end up at the weakest point available. It is a bit like a chain. A chain is as strong as its weakest link. The same can be said when you suffer from a kick or a punch. The weakest part will give way.

So a lot of the ACL injuries come from landing badly on the feet with the knee in a vulnerable position. And if you look at the images from the kick at the Achilles of Walcott you can see that he lands in a strange way on his feet, almost with his toes stuck in the grass. But as he is still moving and as a result of the kick landed awkwardly his knee suffers the impact of both kick and bad landing. The forces from the kick went up his leg and ended up on the ACL which was carrying the weight of his body and the impact of kick and landing bad. Damage was done there. You can be sure about that. Theo stayed down after that. But got up. Adrenaline. A partially rupture of the ACL is not the end of it.

That end came minutes later when he planted his foot to stop a cross and then the complete rupture came from a seemingly innocent incident. And that is what people see.  But that is only the final result. The damage had been done before. If the ACL was ruptured for 75% it still is working and you can run. You lose some stability, you can have a sore knee but as it is still connected it still does its job for a part. And these players are used to pain and their body is full with stuff that makes you run through the pain.

Getting kicks is not just about the injury on the impact zone. It also is about the forces that are sent in your body and that have to find a way to get absorbed somewhere. It is like the tennis elbow. I have suffered from this. And a tennis elbow is an injury you can get from impact on your fingers or wrist. A tennis player can get it from hitting the ball and the forces enter his wrist and end up at his elbow and cause the damage there.

I got it from playing volleyball.  My serves where extremely given with lots off spin that made the ball drop low just over the net and rather close to the net. Of course I didn’t hit the ball with my elbow to serve but with the connection of hand and wrist. As a result however the forces that were made whenever I did such a smash-serve went through my wrist and arm up to my elbow. And as a result I ended up with a tennis elbow and after a few years I had to stop playing at all. Even now when on holiday and wanting to join the people on the beach or in the pool playing what looks like volleyball is something that I cannot do it for more than a few moments.  The pain  comes back each time. Still after having stopped playing some 15 years ago!

So next time you see an injury I just suggest you look further than the incident itself. Unless of course it is a Diaby, Eduardo, Sagna, Ramsey, ….These types of injury are where it is bloody obvious where the injury came from. Otherwise try to find out if previous to the “popping up” of the injury there had been other moments where there was a big impact on that particular part of the body and try to find out if the forces inside the body invisible for us might have contributed to the injury.

If you want to find more about Özil his injury I suggest you try to rewatch both Tottenham and Chelsea matches. You will see a few tackles and fouls (some not given of course) where you might come to the conclusion: hey this could have an inside impact on the knee. The Mason tackle is one but his compatriot Shurle also gave him a rather vicious kick in the first half. No foul given of course.  But I still have to review the match completely. So will be now on the lookout to see if I can spot the foul that did the damage to Özil.

The recent posts and today’s anniversaries

68 Replies to “The search to see exactly how Özil was injured and who was responsible.”

  1. Hey Walter, the next time you find out you have a tail behind you can ask your son. But on a completely serious note, I agree completely with what you have said because i have experienced it myself. years ago my ACL in the left knee ruptured in a practice match. took time off and got back in the game. After marriage i moved to UK and while playing with Arsenal Supporters team, as i was running, for no reason what-so-ever, my right ACL went. on doing research i found that when 1 knee is damanged the stronger knee compensates without you knowing and thereby becoming week.
    unless you get the broken knee fixed properly.
    try telling your analysis to people and you know what reaction you will get.

  2. Totally agree with your article Walter!

    There is another situation where one injures say his/her RIGHT knee, goes through treatment and recovery period, starts training, and suddenly pulls up with a calf injury on the LEFT leg. Thats because the body is still compensating possible weakness (putting extra strain on the body) on the original – right leg injury…this can be psychological too.

    So one ends up with a domino effect of injuries especially when the need for the person to get back on the field is urgent.

  3. Ozil is a very interesting one.

    Read this article and you will see that the players footballing ability has never been in question but his physical ability certainly has

    As the article suggests prior to his move to Arsenal he was considered to be delicate and was not a 90 minute player.

    Since he has been at Arsenal he has suffered several injuries this coupled with playing for the whole 90 minutes in a much faster and clearly more physical league in a world cup year clearly would be an issue if the assessment made just after his move to Arsenal is correct.

  4. well, if it is down to other teams tactics and fouling, we are fortunate to live in a mature democracy, have enough money, people in high places….and lawyers not to just lie down and accept the status quo. Arsenal are a powerful club. If they are doing nothing, I would love to know why.
    May be hard to offer up proof, and we would never convince the media, but who cares about then, surely we have enough circumstantial evidence for someone to have a word? Thought things would improve with Fergie gone…but Jose seems to have taken his place…..

  5. Özil’s selection and performances this past summer in the World Cup, one of only a handful of players in the tournament to go the distance playing every three days over the duration is fairly strong evidence for his levels of stamina, fitness and conditioning in recent times.

    This means, in case anyone is confused, that his fitness was amongst the highest of any player at the World Cup. He didn’t need to be managed through niggles by the German coaches like khadeira or Schweiny.

    This draining run during which he performed at the highest level was the reason why he was given an extended break at the start of the season.

    We can rationally conclude therefore that anyone alleging that the player needed to do more then then the normal bulking up etc. required by most if not all players moving to the PL in their first season are trying too hard to argue the case. It is true that some players need breaks during a season. Especially when not used to not having them. But the simple truth is that any sane physio would say that this applies to all players! It’s a pointless line to take when a player has an impact injury. Duh!

  6. Some 5 yrs ago, I suffered a knee injury while been involved in a training match which I participate in during weekends. It took me about 3 months to recover. Although I was not completely rehabilitated, my love for the game forced me to lace my boots again and enter the field. Less than 10 mins into the match, I got kick behind my leg in a tackle. The impact was on my knee and that ended my involvement in any contact sport till this day. I still feel the pains sometimes when I jog so I understand pretty well where you are coming from.

    Its a really great insite although I’m aware a whole lot of AAA will blame the injuries on Wenger buying fragile injury prone players and his training/tactical methods.

  7. Mandy,

    One valid critisom would be that I’d like to see the physios haul off players immediately when they’ve been “hacked” for a check up. They should’ve made sure they had a look a Walcott after the stamp when he tried, to his credit, to play on. Sanchez wasn’t checked after Melo tried to take him out, someone should’ve had a look IMO.

    Same as Özil on Sunday, any player will always try to play on. It’s the nature of the game. We can’t blame the players for wanting to play on whilst ignoring their physios. They all do it, and they always will! Physios are often ignored by professional athletes: at AFC recent examples include both TV5 and LJW rushing themselves back from injury, which wasn’t the smartest move n their part. But, it is normal!

  8. Tbf if Deschamps is happy to start Sakho over Kozza (he has good reasons I guess -Koscialy did lose his temper in Ukraine…) and rest that ankle over the summer (thanks Didier!) then he probably doesn’t derserve to have a defender of that quality sitting on the bench! Just kidding.
    Im sure Kozza will play against Hull. He just needs rest I guess, probably his physio will or could advise a few months of (that’s just a guess), and I’m also happy to speculate that the player would always ignore such advice!


  10. The responsibility of the injury to Mesut is on the shoulders of PGMOL. They are guardians of players during matches. They don’t care what happens to Arsenal players and allow anyone to damage Arsenal. It is time for a lawsuit by a player/ players union against these cheats to highlight their dereliction of duty.

    I find it difficult to understand why fellow supporters at matches do not see the cheating. They seem to think destruction of skillful players by brutality is within the rules. Very few supporters have actually read & understood the Laws. In fact I am sure most pundits are incapable of understanding the Laws. PGMOL understand everything about the Laws but have a corrupt agenda. I wish them all a real experience of pain so that they are unable to continue inflicting their evil.

    @Mandy the legal side of Arsenal seem devoid of intelligence. Wenger has been quiet because of the FA’s evil bias and past history. It is time for Kronke to get his legal team on the case. He would if it is going to hit his wallet.

  11. Walter, if only a rational explanation like yours ever got into the papers. Seems truth and logic are not desired.

    Mike T, a journalist in today’s paper already said Ozil played for 90 minutes – as if that was the explanation. All this does is avoid finding the real culprits and direct blame at the manager.

    Mandy, I for one believe Arsenal are doing all they can to change the situation. Why would anybody at the club be satisfied with the situation where we are subject to such sustained bias? For all the reasons we have repeatedly discussed on Untold, it is not that easy.

  12. I would love to see Arsenal come out and say Ozil was injured because of the PGMOL. But they would probably be charged with bringing the game into disrepute. And probably be found guilty because the law does not necessarily side with the just.

  13. Nice write up walter…..i agree with wat u said about the impact being sometimes felt in a different part of the body….i can remember when Fabregas had his cruciate ligament done in a game against liverpool,cant remember the season but it was his compatriot Xabi alonso that tackled him,i remember the ball was a loose ball and fabregas slid in to get the ball but Alonso seeing that he had taken the ball he just kicked the ball hard against the feet of Fabregas… did not affect his ankle,it did not break his foot…he was taken off only for us to hear he was likely to be out for 4 months with a knee ligament damage…i used to wonder how on earth that would be so.But like u said the knee ligaments are kind of fragile.i now believe that tackles on the feet can cause damage else where.thanx.

  14. One thing that most people ignore is that our bone is bad at absorbing shocks. A big impact will break it into two. But small impacts that don’t reach the threshold is transmitted along the bone and into the weak areas. Such as ligaments and joints……

  15. Another great article and its very nice to get some perspective on things related to Arsenal as opposed to cut and dry, black and white, knee-jerk opinions. The referees really don’t protect us at the moment and this is, in my opinion, why a team like Barcelona have been able to flourish playing free-flowing football and we aren’t able to in England properly. OK every team could do with a player like Vieira or Gilberto but this isn’t a rule in world football. If a manager wants to win things playing a technically gifted team against physical opponents then he should be allowed to do so in the name of football- and it is a referees duty to protect players against dirty tactics. Football in general is really in need of a big shake up in its governing bodies, the corruption is so clear, and referees are the biggest ways to influence who wins a game. Hence why video technology is disgracefully rejected everytime it’s brought up. This is 2014, and we still face the same problems that were rife decades ago. I can see a bright future for the game and when that happens, Arsenal will be right at the top.

  16. I have to be Devil’s Advocate here. When Vieira was going around kicking lumps out of anyone who dared take the ball near him we respected the toughness of the Arsenal midfield. Now that the team is lightweight we point an accusatory finger at any team that plays aggressively. Fact is that it’s part of the game and Arsenal need to have that element in the way they play. Vieira still has one of the worst disciplinary records of any player ever in the Premier League but you don’t often hear any of us Arsenal fans complaining about it.

  17. @menace
    October 9, 2014 at 2:31 pm

    Agree with all in your post!

    I guess what would really hurt Kroenke’s pocket is if due to a magnitude of injuries – Arsenal were reduced to playing 5 seniors and the rest from our youth squad – would almost guarantee outside top 4 (NO CL next year) and for sure we can not dream about any PL/FACup… someone is out of pocket then (as I have written in a previous post)

  18. At the end of the day it’s a conflict of styles but it’s ironic how, and I am as guilty as anyone, we look down on defensive teams when Arsenal used to be the most boring and defensive team in the land. When you support a team that plays that way the result is everything and entertainment comes purely from success rather than enjoying the performance. Ask any Chelsea fan. 5 shots when playing at home and they’re destined for invincibility, pull the other one.

  19. One defence of Wenger we often hear is how good he is at finding cheap talent and how he kept us in the top four on a zero net spend. At the end of the 2012/2013 season, we finished two points behind Chelski and five behind City. Since then, Wenger has spent £120m on players, including £43m on Ozil and yet we’re falling further behind them. Obviously some players have left and have needed to be replaced, but the 2013 team did not need another seven first team players to be challenging. A top striker and a top DM would have made the world of difference to last season’s campaign, but I won’t need to remind you of the time he wasted trying to land Suarez and while I’m not quite as anti-Arteta as some of my fellow Gooners, I’m sure he could have done better than him and Flamini. Trust me, Kroenke didn’t wake Wenger up on 1st June and say “guess what Arsene, you can have some money now”. I don’t believe that money was as tight as our manager made out, but even giving him the benefit of the doubt, he would have known about all the extra money coming in for months, at the very least. He had all the time he needed to identify targets and then go all out to get them and any he missed out on, he’s had two more windows since. Moanio has had the same amount of time since returning to the PL and while you can argue that he had a stronger base to start from, you can’t argue that he hasn’t bought the exact players he needed, spending less in the process. If Wenger had just taken over as manager, then it’d be a different story, but he has had years to think about which players he needed and we don’t need seven of them. What we need is a new manager, who can get the best out of what is already a good squad, then identify the weaknesses and address them.

  20. Walter,  It is 100% Wenger’s fault. How on earth he has not managed to find adequate cover is beyond human reason. At least with united they can compensate by the attacking talent. No matter what you say they are grinding out the results whereas we are honking the donkey.

  21. Vince…. Why so serious? I think we cd make 3rd this time if injuries don’t decimate us for long periods. Not replacing TV is oft used as another red herring to hit at Wenger. TV he was so unfit that he cd rarely play even when we have needed him. Hes till unfit. Good business to seel him for that price though we ve sold a few crocks to Barca down the years, Van B and Pettit and Overmars come to mind. Its hard to buy a 3rd CB whos hardly going to play hence Chambers is the gamble in that position plus there a few really good CBs in football right now. Its got some thing to do with defending being unfashionable and the rule changes have made defending hard to excel at. We do need a ‘shield’type player because of the weaknesses in defence though. Im not a Koschielny fan and big Mert has his limitations doesnt he. We ve lacked a Ya Ya Toure type for years too. They dont grow on trees though. I think we ll see some decent things from the team yet. We ve stuttered a bit agreed but the possible Khedira deal seems to still have legs?

  22. @Hect – We don’t have to wait until the season drifts on to find ourselves in a familiar position we already are, and we’ll not have to wait to find out how it’ll end either, that’s common knowledge. As for the weaknesses being exposed they already have been also (more times than we can count)but all easily rectified if it wasn’t for the biggest weakness of all, the old man who lives in a shoe who tells us he’s a manager and made many substitutions but still doesn’t know what to do. And has been continually exposed for years now and will continue to be, and be our biggest weakness until he’s sent back to his shoe permanently.
    Oh and you know you have reached rock bottom when your saying Isaac Hayden could do a job looooool. Are you having a laugh?? Wow standards have dropped –

  23. i think most fans/observers who are honest, be they supportive of things now or not supportive would say that the case v Arsene certainly cranked up a few notches after OT in 2011. I was there that day too and despite the brilliant after match support as we were locked into the Theatre of Fixed Home matches, the real noises started i think. My hunch is AW will be in his chair for the next 12-18 months so much of the passionate drive to shift him is wasted energy really in my view. 

  24. Hect – We have had this discussion before and I agree with you that it obviously cannot be made explicit. Perhaps what I am asking for is for the club not to rub our faces in it quite so much. I disagree about all the money arguments. There was truth to it but you could also argue that it was an excuse for keeping expectations down. After all BD and Athletico manage to put a dent in the big guns. We now have a wage bill twice the Spuds and bigger than Chelsea. Our record against the top sides over the last 4 seasons is appalling. And it will be something of a miracle to win anything after only 7 games this season. If you feel that is value for Petes 2k season ticket then we have different values. The late lamented Ron argued rightly in my opinion that if you pay top dollar to see a play you dont expect the actors to keep forgetting their lines or words to that effect.

  25. I think arguing about wage spend comparatives is pointless. We don’t know how the clubs differentiate between who gets the big pay and who doesn’t and we dont know the wage bill effects of Chelsea loanees either.However, what we do know in my view is that Chelsea have bought well and it has to be said that they’ve bought better, stronger and more durable players than we have. Im guessing the pay taken by a Costa there is massive compared to the lesser lights (such as they may be called that) in the team and to be honest, that’s how it should be. I don’t think Arsenal have had such differences to a great enough extent. The so called major players haven’t earned much more than the non producers. I cant be sure of this but it seems a reasonable assumption. Mourinho comes across as an odious man, but i guess privately off a footie field hes maybe OK. He seems a good family man. Fact is, hes very impressive as a Coach and Chelsea are as a team. Hes bolder than AW in my view and puts winning at the top of his agenda. AW puts his ‘philosophy’ where winning should be. I think it was ‘Ron’ who once said philosophy should remain in University libraries, not football Clubs dressing rooms. I agree with that to the greater extent.Maybe Mourinho is hungrier because his job depends on it? Is it his age though or is it just him as a man?

    I dont know, but back AW as i do, he s not in Mourinhos league now as a Coach. JM has seen it all and done it all at massive Clubs who want to own the World tomorrow so he will be better wont he? Hes managing a little village store compared to what hes experienced. When AW does go, i think the Club need a man of the same mettle to be honest. –

  26. Hect: Very good post which makes valid points. Two outstanding young managers in world football at the moment are Kloop and Simeone and if I was given the choice I would choose Kloop. Simeone reminds me too much of a young Mourinho with all the dark arts that come with it. Kloop comes across mad as a box of frogs, or a bit of character as you will, but his teams play progressive, attacking football with plenty of young guns.

  27. Vincelorne,
    this is my last warning.
    You come on here spout the same comment you already posted in another comment section. So another cut and paste an probably not even from yourself.

    This article is about how players can get injured. About how forces inside body can work.

    If you can’t stick to the subject you better stay away or we will make you stay away. If you have nothing of interest to say about the subject then you can always make no comment at all. You are acting like a troll the way you do.

    By the way Dortmund also face a heavy injury crisis this season. Despite Klopp (this is his real name by the way not Kloop)

    Thank you.

  28. May I also ask other people to not reply to such completely out of line comments. I know it is difficult not to but then at least we can keep it about the subject of the article.

    Thank you.

  29. “A man of the same mettle?” Youwhatguv?
    A specialist in signing players signed to special agents? Hmmm. No. Not after the way AFC (&not AW) got rid of GG, it’s not going to happen! Sorry.

    Kenneth asked me to repost a comment from elsewhere:

    A few weeks ago an Arsenal podcast had on former manager John Gregory. He said some interesting things that they didn’t comment or respond on. First up he said the one player he’d have to rate above the others in this current squad was Arteta, obviously for his leadership and character over the recent rebuilding process which the Expert Groaners denied was happening at the time (they wanted the club to follow the wisdom of Tiny Tottenham or Liverpool). No comment from the podcast hosts on that choice! Interesting.

    Secondly and most importantly why was there no response on their podcast/by the hosts to the comments from John Gregory praising AFC as representing the best in English football? What do they understand his words to mean? Could they understand them? If they agreed with him, why did they simply not say that they agreed? It sounded like they didn’t get it. Which is odd? For die hard fans of the Arsenal?

    Is this stand out oddness a result of the Groaners inability to acknowledge the marriage between Arsene and AFC. Instead they have chosen to attack the manager repetitively like sad rabid yet neutered and lame Newcastle or Blackburn fans, turning their own support against the values and history of AFC. Going to war against their own club. Yet we all know GG was sacked for taking a bung of a few grand, which is loose change to the ins and outs of the contemporary super agent bungs involved in the Neymar deal etc. Dav1d Lui7 to PSG etc.

    As GeoffArsenal tells ‘em: “it’s not FIFA.”
    Can they understand what he is telling them, between the lines, or are they too stupid? Or worse then that?

    For experts in finance and football why don’t they admit and accept that AFC are operating in a different market to the one run by some super agents. It’s obvious to anyone who can count, they have no excuse. None. A market where Alexis costs half of di Maria, where Welbeck a regular England international costs a lot less then Lallana who is not a regular, and Welbeck is also younger. Where Chambers cost half of Shaw. So many other examples. Utd paid £20M or close to Mendes for Anderson years and years ago! They have absolutely no excuse for ignoring this data. The contrast in these transfer fees is not an opinion, it is a result of a policy. A fairly obvious and easy to understand policy, you’d think, and hope…certainly only someonesuffering from myopia would attempt to argue that this policy is dictated by the manager, who is an employee of the club.

    These Groaners want the club, not the manager, to change their historical policy and to sign players locked in with super agents etc. Why do they want the club to be like the specialist in signing players signed to special agent Mendes? Why do they want AFC to be like Gazprom on and off the pitch? Why do they no longer support AFC?* When even the Arseblogger points out that AFC don’t do business with the likes of Costa and Falcao’s owner and master, why and how are they in denial? That is a fair question! It is interesting to me that the Groaners chosen allies in the media just happen to be the sort that like to promote debt peonage in society. They’ve allied with people who could make Alan Partdrige sound like a good/sane football plundit. It’s unreal (And Steve Coogan is a genius!).

    *we all know about the problems in modern Football, the treatment of supporters by the broadcasters etc.: (and that the media report AFC as being the most expensive team to watch when below the top prices it’s cheaper then Tottenham!) but this has very little to do with their continuous attacks on someone who is acknowledged by all in the Game to be a Proper Football Man. Alongside many others the AST contributed to the Football White Paper in 2010 but since then they’ve blown alot of credibility, and now the real potential long term concern which imight be Kronke has one less credible supporters group to keep an eye on him. Bear in mind AFC use to give these groups more support and money he any other big UK club. Well done those idiots! The same idiots who of course completely ignored the incredible melodramatic deathbed handover story from Fizman to Kronke. For all we know (we don’t!) it was Fizman AND Dein’s ntention to play the Wal-Mart feudalist off against the gas guzzling mobster: the only mandate a supporters group had was that they had to keep a beady eye on Kronke. Nothing to do with what goes on the pitch. But. Well, they took their eye off the football, what with so much self-promotion going on, and now, as said above, as a result of their own bleatings they have neutered themselves and any credibility that they had. A public act of self-castration. Not a good look! I don’t recommend it.

    It’s been a poor show from these ginormous football brains over the years. They have too much time and energy and probably money invested in being Groaners.

    Finally on Koscielny, really the player should’ve taken the summer off, he’d have been advised to do so. But well, Chambers is ridciculously good! Funny how the Groaners are trying to attack AWs purchases above as Chambers puts Shaw into the shadows with his performances. I couldn’t make it up! Haha, And Hayden showed against a very good Southampton team that he’s not too far behind the England player. I like both and I wouldn’t mind seeing both in the shirt. I have a hunch that one or the other could even pinch the BFGs starting berth by the start of next year. Possibly. Maybe another will come in too. It’s all good.

  30. Walter,
    Thank you for your indepth analysis and description of these sort of injuries. I was going down the comments enjoying the contributions till I came to the barrage of nonsense starting from about 3:37pm. I mean seriously, can we ever have a discussion here about a subject without s
    thinonsense? Anyway, glad you sorting this out.

    Back to these types of injuries, absolutely true that impact elsewhere can be felt in a different part of body. Anyone recall a champions league match where fabregas took a penalty and tore his ligaments? Mesut was injured by that spud tramp, and that other weasel schuller finished him off.

  31. @ Hector

    You mention about Chelsea loanees and wage bills in general.

    Here is something that will no doubt cause a few gulps.

    Wages paid to every player be they on loan or part of the clubs squad/ academy is paid and accounted for by the owning club. Sums paid in respect of the loan fees paid in respect of players out on loan are shown in transfer income.

    Now reflect on the fact that it is being widely reported that Arsenals 2014/15 wage bill will exceed Chelsea’s and I suspect when details of Chelsea’s 2013/14 income is published it will be I excess of the £300 million shown in Arsenals latest accounts

  32. Glad you did Fins, and I thought that UA would like what you wrote over at PA.Good to see you added the last bit on Kos.
    Sorry Walter my fault! .)

  33. Back on thread.
    Tendonitis or Athlete’s Bane as I call it:

    Koscielny, really the player should’ve taken the summer off, it’s a reasonable guess that he’d have been advised to do so. But well, how many players refuse to go to the WC? Chamberlain should’ve stayed at home too, but it was a nice reward from the manager towards a player who had performed for him in the past.

    I am not crying and this is the reason why: Chambers is ridiculously good. It’s true. Funny how the Groaners are trying to attack AWs purchases above as Chambers puts Shaw into the shadows with his performances. I couldn’t make it up! Haha, And Hayden showed against a very good Southampton team that he’s not too far behind the England player (Chambers). I like both and I wouldn’t mind seeing both in the shirt. I have a hunch that one or the other could even pinch the BFGs starting berth by the start of next year. Possibly. Maybe another will come in too. It’s all good.

    It is true that in recent seasons since Chamberlain broke through that the club are giving more protection and less minutes to teenagers. Nineteen and then they are allowed to play, but wvventhenhow unlucky have both Chamberlain and Gnabry been. Chamberlain of course was Anthony Taylored, just another example of what is being discussed on this thread, He may get some extra minutes now. So Chambers, they’all want to give hi a breather at some point, not ideal he’s playing for England tbh. It is fair to say that the club could do with another CB for that reason but even then I think it’s cool till January. Following the Southampton game there’s no doubt that I’d prefer to see Hayden over a journeyman thirtysomething CB.

  34. Yes Mike T.

    But your club has an owner, manager and captain that have shown they would be prepared to do anything to get what they want, regardless of rules and ethics, and even laws and peoples lives in your owners case.

    I like most wouldn’t trust anything that comes out of your club in the present regime, and certainly not your accounts with FFP now being half implemented

  35. And the notion Ozil is a 90min player is absolutely bonkers, and should be dismissed with the contempt it deserves. It’s designed to deflect blame from the real culprits, who hacked Ozil, onto Wenger for overusing Ozil. As Finsbury already pointed out, he played in all German games, mostly finishing them all including two extra time games. And there was short space between these games too.

  36. Obviously omitted the word NOT in error, should read “And the notion that Ozil is NOT a 90min player… “

  37. Walter/Tony

    We all want to do something to promote fair play and competent refereeing within the EPL. Unfortunately we get zero help from the media – in fact the media protect the thugs and the biased and appalling refereeing.

    As an alternative – is it possible to run a third string to the Untold bow – showing the thug tackles, esp where incorrectly called by the refs, our players have suffered match after match?

    The Invinciple’s 50 would be a good place to start – and run appropriate footage up to Cahill’s deliberate assault on Sanchez. No need to comment much – but just keep showing the fouls and ref inaction until something changes at the top?

  38. @ Initals BB

    That’s your prerogative but in terms of the accounts you really are barking up the wrong tree.

  39. Bjtgooner,

    yes that sure would be a nice idea. If we could reach out to the whole gooner world we could maybe end up with a compilation of serious fouls, causing injuries or not, with the result on the field. And in fact to make it complete we could add the ones that were made by Arsenal players and add the punishment to it.
    It would show the difference even more.

    Maybe I will try to write an article about it and then if we can work on the social media we could work something out.

  40. For the others…. FFS read my 4.09 comment.

    When the ref warns one player for a type of foul this goes for all the players on the field. 😉

  41. Hopefully I’ll somehow manage to avoid that yellow that is now due (thanks Ken!) till the 88th minute! “Gamesmanship” ‘innit 😉

  42. Oh no the referee has taken my number!
    As long as I just get a warning whilst the opposition get sent to the sin bin it’s all good.

  43. I think having played all those games and the world cup will not have helped of course.
    If you look at how many German players are injured for months now it shows that the calender is much too heavy for the players.
    We have to cut down on playing matches. We could start with leaving out all international friendlies. A complete ban of all international friendlies would take some 5 or 6 games away each season for the top players.
    Not being able to practice with the national team that way? So what? All teams are treated the same so nobody is having any advantage or disadvantage.

  44. @Walter

    I like the idea of reaching out to the gooner world for help, I’m sure it will be forthcoming.

  45. In international cricket the broadcasters determine the schedules. And they want to make money! So the calendar is full of far too many games. It’s reached the point in the sport where international managers have no choice but rotate players in and out of teams. It’s a little bit more complicated with the different formats in the sport. Some countries now have one day squads that are completely different to the test squads, and it doesn’t always work! Too many games. Not good.

    I have long felt that under the stewardship of FUFA that international football would head down the same path. The players at simply cattle for the administrators, or worse. Arsenal are lucky at the moment because the club seem to have a good relationship with the current England and German managers.

  46. I think vincelorne/hector likes to talk to himself without regard to the original post.


    Your post at 4:25 was just as good the second time. Keep fighting the good fight.

    I’m going to start a youtube channel highlighting the violence perpetrated against Arsenal. The main problem I’m having is where to obtain footage. I’ve reached out to some guys that do compilations but have not heard back yet. Do any UA people know where I can download full match files, not just stream the video?

  47. @ Mike T 1:46

    You can pull any/every article to try and deflect the fact that chelsea kicked Arsenal off the park on sunday, as they always do when morinho is around. As far as I’m concerned, this is the only way morinho can play against us. As pointed out already, Ozil was one of the fittest players at both WC2010 and 2014. Your silence on cahill’s challenge on Sanchez is very perculiar. Also, if you have time, please do a ref review(like you did) of Arsenal vs chelsea @ the emirates last season. You know, the one with the stamp on Arteta and the Theo penalty.

  48. @Wengerperson

    You really need to read my postings before you start to make comments about what I have or have not said about Cahills tackle .

    The stats are there to support the fact that Ozil played a significant part in the WC but reflect on what the impact of playing those game possibly has had in both respect of his performance levels and now this injury and also for how long he has had problems. From what I read it goes back to October 2013 whilst on international duty.

  49. @ Mike T

    “From what I read it goes back to October 2013 whilst on international duty.”
    Well, from what I saw it goes back to both the tottenham and chelsea games October 2014 whilst playing for Arsenal!

  50. It’s a strange mentality that deems to label anyone who wants to question something, as “bringing the game into disrepute”.

    If Arsenal does speak out, they will indeed be persecuted, as all revolutionists are, but Arsenal is starting to show it’s teeth as a warning. I think there are probably things going on behind the scenes.

    But sites like Untold take up the fight to highlight these things to the people who care. (Not un-similar(i make words up) to the conspiracy theorists, in fact Untold has been called this many times)).

    The ball is in Arsenal’s court, and we better learn to use it well, for it may be all we have for a little while.

  51. Everyone keep telling Arsenal players are bunch of lightweights, but we have Flamini, Diaby, Wilshere and Koscielny as well three tough recruits this season, Welbeck, Chambers and Sanchez. Everyone keep telling Chelsea muscled us out but after Arsenal punch back in the first half, Chelsea players were very timid and quiet in the second half especially Jose. When everyone keep telling Arsenal got bad disciplinary record, they forget that our cards per foul ratio are the highest in EPL for more than 10 years old. Chelsea are not tough, they are just bullies. And when you strike back a bully, he will go back into his pathetic shell like a dirty b***h. Come on, Gunners, rise above the hate, rise and storm like a volcano. A cloud of ashes gonna cover EPL soon.

  52. Last night England had 5 Arsenal players on the field at the same time (can’t remember that ever happening before), and thats excluding Theo who for sure would be up for selection once fit to play. Admittedly it was a game that was 100% winnable by some margin even before the final whistle.

    If though, it is to be a fixed situation for the England team to have such a large number of Arsenal players in the starting eleven – how would the National team (the management) react when our players can not represent the country because they are so badly injured due to the PL leagues’ lack of protection for its own players??

    Interesting days ahead!

    Suddenly we might see our foreign players getting the injuries and our English players getting full protection.

  53. Walter dont publish this re apo Armani Thoe will find it very difficult to play for England again all the time Hodgeson is manager
    My brother in law is a MP and was in Hodgesons company before the WC and in a chat told him he does not reckon Theo , but does this show that he was chosen because nobody else was fit and as soon as Townsends fit he gets part of a game.

  54. @Steve Vallins
    October 10, 2014 at 7:33 pm

    I don’t quite understand – what it is of mine – that you don’t wish Walter to publish!!!

  55. The inside knowledge that if Thoe gets into the England side its because Hodgeson has no other option he does not reckon him so to have 6 Arsenal players in an England side wont happen

  56. Tendonitis of the elbow. Tennis elbow. There is a tendon, which runs around the elbow, and if it gets inflamed (which often leads to the formation of scar tissue), we call this tendonitis (swollen tendon is the translation).

    Our arms are quite useful, and get used in lots of things, such as hitting tennis balls. Anything which involves the flexion or extension of the elbow, can aggravate that tendon.

    Is the fact that so many people in so many different kinds of endeavours can injure that tendon, due to the complexity of the forearm? Nearly all the muscles for our hands are in our forearms, and we just run tendons down to the joints within the hand and fingers.

    The recipe for most injuries is RICE: Rest, Ice, Compression, Elevation. Most people seem to think that if you leave an injury long enough, it will come back good as new. And tennis elbow tickles this more than most. And the answer is no, just resting an injury won’t make it come back good as new.

    If scar tissue has formed on the tendon, it needs to be removed. The way to start removing scar tissue, is to stress the tendon. But that breaks the scar tissue/tendon interface in place, which cause inflamation and more scarring. So, as soon as you do your workout to start stressing that tendon, you need to ice the elbow to slow down blood flow, and hence the formation of new scar tissue. Deep (strong) massage can also help break up that scar tissue, but again, you need to ice the region to restrict how much new scar tissue gets added. And eventually, you should get a scar free tendon that doesn’t hurt any more.

  57. The German media are now obsessed with their belief that Özil is going to Bayern based on the idea that he hasnt played well for Arsenal.
    Poldi spoke in the Kölner Stadt-anzeiger and again mentioned being frustrated at being on the bench and if the situation is similar in Jan.then he will look at this situation.
    COYG etc

  58. Rantetta,
    Kudos directly to you. As I recall, you pointed out how Theo was assaulted WHEN it first happened. The assailant’s name was named. You’re not self-promoting, but some of us recall and appreciate what you did. Full Credit where it’s due.

    Clattenburg’s blind-eye reffing ought to be put under a microscope and fans ought to take the finger out and hold up posters at the Ems to let him know that we’re on to him. Light is the disinfectant for vermin.

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