Efficient Arsenal (More Numbers!)
By Pete
At the start of the season I wrote an article attempting to tie our improved form to our increasingly impressive defence I am pleased to note that this trend has continued through this season so thought it opportune to compare again the frequencies of goals scored and conceded to demonstrate how efficient we have been this season.
As a comparison, I have extended the analysis to Man City and Chelsea (there is practically no chance of anyone else winning the League – although there is a fair chance of one or two of the current top three being overhauled – just not all three). This analysis helps explain why we are still ahead (just!) of Man City at the time of publishing, even though our goal difference is much worse – and that our position is fully deserved.
My methodology is to review the frequencies of goals scored and then goals conceded. This way we can see what our expected points total should be. This is based on League games only (up to and including Fulham – so the first 22 matches). I acknowledge that this is one of several ways to compare performances but believe we can draw some useful conclusions.
Arsenal
Goals Scored
0 goals – 2 times
1 goal – 5 times
2 goals – 8 times
3 goals – 6 times
4 goals – 1 time
Goals Conceded
0 goals – 10 times
1 – 10
3 – 1
6 – 1
So, for example, if Arsenal score 1 goal in a match (22.7% likelihood) then we will win 45.4% of the time, draw 45.4% of the time and lose 9.1% of the time (rounding means this does not exactly equal 100%).
Based on this analysis, Arsenal “should” have racked up 51.3 points which is very close to the actual number of 51 points.
Now for Man City and Chelsea:
Manchester City
Goals Scored
0 goals – 2 times
1 – 3
2 – 5
3 – 5
4 – 4
6 – 2
7 – 1
Goals Conceded
0 goals – 8 times
1 – 6
2 – 5
3 – 3
Manchester City should have acquired 50.1 points and actually got 50. So, again, very close but – significantly – still behind Arsenal.
Chelsea
Goals Scored
0 goals – 4 times
1 – 2
2 – 9
3 – 5
4 – 2
Goals Conceded
0 goals – 8 times
1 – 10
2 – 2
3 – 2
Chelsea should have managed 47.5 points and actually managed 49 – so a little better. Jose’s ability to drag a result kicking and screaming from a dull low-scoring match?
We can see here that we do indeed deserve to be top and all the adulation for Manchester City is not actually justified by their performances. More specifically, the principal reason for them being behind Arsenal at the moment of publication is having a weaker defence. This was clearly demonstrated, I think, by their being taken all the way by a plucky (cliché alert) Watford in the Cup. Watford may even have got a win or draw if they had not dropped/rested Almunia…
Therefore I would opine that the most important contributor to our current standing is the defence. I would suggest that Sz/Bac/Mert/Koz/Gibbs have all been outstanding this season – their best seasons ever in each case, with the possible exception of Sagna who has been so consistent for so long. But a key contributor has been the LACK of serious injury to any of the 5. Gibbs has missed a few, but Monreal is virtually at the same level.
Therefore, I would argue that a key determinant in our ability to stay the pace is the ability or good fortune for these 5 to stay fit for most of the remainder of the season. If they do – and, to be honest, it would defy our recent injury history – then we have a great chance.
Absolutely true, its vital we keep those defenders fit. Especially Sagna as I think it takes Jenks a few games to find his rhythm and settle back into the team. Its a shame Vermaelen was injured recently when there was an opportunity to get a few games under his belt
So true, we need them fit. But as I have already ranted, our injury record is starting to worry me, with the players out, and untrusted replacements, this could really bite us.
Surely the powers that be within the club must realise there is an issue with the injuries we get? A costly issue as well.
If in my humble position of knowing little of such things, if I could change anything within the club, it would be find a way of reducing these injuries. Other teams seem to and on a consistent basis, I really get the feeling some are over played, and some are rushed back.
Off topic, my apologies.
Did anybody hear Mourinho’s quotes after the West Ham game? One gem in particular (before reading this, consider the way Mourinho set up his team at the Emirates and didn’t play any strikers at Old Trafford. And how Chelsea play in general).
Mourinho had a go at West Ham by saying:
“I don’t think with matches like this we can sell Premier League across the world.”
Also “It was football from another century.”
What a hypocritical, nasty man he is. I despise him.
Hilarious the hypocacy of Jose, he complains about those that complain, then complains himself, he moans about arsenal being boring in our recent game saying the emphasis was on the home team to break down the bus Parkers , then this, but the media will still be firmly up him tomorrow
If only more teams were to start doing this to them. Though this is not a nice thought towards the good of the football, but well, fight boredom with boredom. Goes to show what an evil influence this guy is.
Come on , give the guy a break (please !) , after all it was a another tough London derby !
@Brickfield – Hahahaha
I actually agree with Jose! Who better understands the 19th century game than him…Chewing-gum Allardyce just borrowed a leaf out of his book…just one time I wouldn’t mind saying Well done Sam for the point and the post match comments.
Thanks,
Asif
Maybe I am completely arsenal-blinded so I see all wrong, but I am not scared of free-scoring City. Yes I agree they are good, they are actually very good. But, they filling nets of teams whom we can beat as well. Only difference there is that they wont stop, they wont switch of, they will keep filling nets mercilessly but as well conceding goals.
At the moment, they are better from us mostly (apart from that one point) only because where we win 3:0 they win 6:0 and so… Yes it can be important difference once in May, especially in such tight race, but they are not even inch better team from us.
Watching last night game I realized there is overtime, added time, SAF time, and now we have Jose time.
i thought only Arsene whinged when he doesn’t get what he want , funny how all the media don’t pick up on jose whinging after a considerably smaller club ( interms of current money and current talent) played park the bus , just like he did against us and MUtd with the super talents at his disposal and super money that he has.
I had a laugh at Allardycs’s response to a question from a Jose loving reporter.
Reporter:Jose was pretty scathing of your tactic
Sam: (Almost maniac laughter) he cant take it can he, we out tactited him and he cant take it.
What a true observation from him.
Your greatness is measured by your kindness; your education and intellect by your modesty; your ignorance is betrayed by your suspicions and prejudices, and your real caliber is measured by the consideration and tolerance you have for others.
William J.H. Boetcker (1873-1962)
We’re second which is probably where we deserve to be. I see City’s away record is improving. Once we build an attack force like theirs we’ll be winning the odd trophy or two. Let’s see how we can avenge ourselves after the hiding they gave us at the Etihad.
The fact is that City don’t need a stronger defence because they have a much better offence than any team in the league. You can make a case for Watford doing better with Almunia in goal (really? he was one of the reasons we had such a poor defence for years and is where he belongs, in a championship side) but as seen many times this season a lead against City is hard to defend. To even imagine Watford would stop an irresistible force like Aguero, Navas and Dzeko is a little naive.
Wenger has finally got a decent defence after years of failing to get it right. Though we need a better full back than Jenkinson, we should splash out on Luke Shaw. The midfield is stuffed with talent too but it lacks a little dynamism. The only weak area is the attack. Augment that and we’ll be genuine contenders for any and every trophy.
@Brickfields, some of the posters on here could do well to heed these words, “and your real caliber is measured by the consideration and tolerance you have for others.”
Yes Rupert, we always see your real caliber.
@Florian, cheers mate. You’ve noticed how polite I am on the whole except for the odd occasion when I’ve been a little elated and decided to unleash a little invective on the few fascists that drag their jackboots all over this site like disappointed Tories in drag.
Seems we might be signing Vucinic on loan as Wenger realizes he needs some striking options which was plainly obvious back in August. Of course if we don’t get a striker we’ve still got Bendtner, Park (Bench, as he spends most of his time on it, when he can be located) and Sanogo, wherever he is. No wonder City are favourites to win the title.
Draxler deal seems to be almost done but don’t hold your breath. Great talent apparently but why on earth do we need another midfielder? Concentrate on strikers Wenger, see if you can unearth one as good as Suarez or Aguero.
Glean from this ,what you may ….
A giant ship engine failed.
The ship owners tried one expert after another
But none of them could figure out how to fix the engine.
Then they called in an external consultant
who had been fixing ships since he was young.
He carried a large bag of tools with him
On arrival, he inspected the engine thoroughly.. very carefully, top to bottom.
Two of the ship owners were there, watching this man, hoping he would know what to do.
After a thorough inspection,the consultant reached for his tool kit and pulled out a small hammer
He gently tapped something. Instantly, the engine came to life. He carefully put his hammer away.
The engine was fixed and the ship owners were happy.
A week later, the ship owners received a bill
from the consultant.
It read US$10,000.
The ship owners were surprised at the consultant’s fee of 10,000 dollars.
One of them was heard exclaiming What?! He hardly did anything!
So, they sent the consultant a note saying
‘please send an itemized bill’
The consultant sent the bill that read…
“Tapping with hammer ……$2.00
Knowing where to tap …. $9,998.00″
Our right back backup is not good enough. Let’s splash the cash on a left back then….
Spare me the familiarities Rupert. Until the day when you post without having a dig at anything Arsenal, you’re going to be an AAA.
Heard that our outside right is being left outside and the outside left in turn is being kept right outside !
@Florian, and when you learn to think for yourself you’ll finally throw off your communist background. As for this AAA crap that’s a load of bull made up by people on here who despise people daring to have an opinion that differs from their own. Have a nice day.
@Walter, I thought Wenger was a genius at converting players to any position.
I can smll the Ammonia and Methane from here, someone put the cover back on!
we have one of the best academies in Europe
http://www.sportingintelligence.com/2014/01/21/revealed-barcelona-best-at-producing-big-5-players-ajax-most-across-europe-210101/
I see City have reported a 51 million pound loss which exceeds the FFP limit. Wonder what’ll happen, my guess, nothing.
Rupert, you have no idea what you’re talking about.
I didn’t know you had the same genius Rupert.
at least citys players are better than their accountants.
Tottenham just play like accountants
@Walter, you have the genius to make people believe that there is a conspiracy against Arsenal despite there being no logical reason for it and despite the fact that there’s no proof that any of your ref reports are actually true. Seems we all have hidden talents.
@Florian, and neither do you.
@ Rupert,
I am going to go watch the south park episode where they make fun of people with small dicks, seems relevant some how
Our self invited unreformed sewer rat seems full of anger as well as bull***t this morning. Are they smoking something down in the nest?
Of course Rupert we have invented the matches on our playstation and then made a ref review about it. 🙂
@Walter, I don’t think you get my point. For all I know you could write a load of bull about ref decisions. Why should I, or anyone, believe it? You claim there were so many wrong decisions in one game but who checks your reasoning? You say you have a team of independent refs watching Arsenal games. Really, we only have your word for it. People are so gullible but I can fully understand why they want to believe want they do, it’s a good excuse for years of just trundling along which is what Arsenal have done.
Imagine if this was some City site performing and they had a person like yourself performing the same function, would you take not question it? You’d no doubt disbelieve it which is what most questioning minds would do and let’s face it most opposing fans would do.
“City site and they had a person…..” correct myself.
Rupert,
in case you missed it http://www.refereedecisions.co.uk/
You can find each game we reviewed in detail. Check each decision. Even the simplest decisions like a throw in.
Each game we reviewed is open for anyone to challenge any decision.
And just in case: the majority of the referees who reviewed the matches were not Arsenal supporters!
@Walter
Really Walter, you should stop with playstation games, see where it brings you. Or at least change game, start with Football Manager, soon you ll see how many players we can bring, and that “stupid frogman” wont even consider it. I once played Gibs CF and and he scored more goals than Giroud. I am really wandering why Arsene don’t want try it.
@Rupert
Apart from few dictators, whom you can find anywhere, nothing wrong with communism as idea or having communist background.
Just noticed: So you are calling me a liar.
Problem is I cannot show you the names of the people who helped me on this as they all wanted their names not mentioned. To keep them out of possible trouble for their own referee career. In fact I am the only one who has his name out in the open.
To review all those games myself I would have needed another year I think. Just ask any old reviewer how much time you need to do a game.
But if you keep on insinuating that I am dishonest then I don’t see the need to answer to you any more.
In my mother language we have a saying that goes (badly translated) like this ‘you judge people, by your own way of doing’. Maybe by insinuating that I am a liar or being dishonest you…
Why would anybody come here to give an opinion different from supporting the club, manager and players?
Last night after Nigeria lost on penalties to Ghana at semi final of the ongoing chan (Football tournament for home base players only), many Nigerians were fuming and berating the boys and the coach. The same people that celebrated, praised and bragged about the same boys and coach when they came from 3 goals down to beat Morrocco in the quarter final.
At the same viewing centre, chelsea fans are ‘doublely’ sad. Sad for Nigeria’s loss and for chelsea’s draw. The same people who celebrated a ‘sure’ 3 points b4 d match started.
I gave them all an advice (still relevant now). Football is a passionate game. The passion is almost always at the extreme. You are extremely happy when all is well and extremely sad when it’ not. To rain abuses and insult on players and coaches is definitely out of place, childish and an effort at futility. If you are lucky to follow a club, do more to know its philosophy and direction. If it’s different from what you believe, find another club that best suits you.
Therefore, support Arsenal or find another.
COYG!
I really enjoy coming onto untold and usually find the comments section to be just as enlightening as the articles . Over the years there is often the odd person who comes across as a real annoyance which is understanderble and while I think it’s great to hear all sides of an argument rather than selectively read things that reinforce your own beliefs, I have to confess to usually skipping over Rupert’s comments as I just find the whole process of debating him tedious and laborious. I don’t feel like I have lost out on much in terms of debate as I can usually guess what he will say before reading
Walter, today is at least the third time the rupert has questioned your integrity. He has previously, twice, been taken to task on this point, still he persists. I cannot represent the views of other contributors, but I am tired of the rupert’s anti Arsenal, anti Wenger, anti team and now anti Walter snide comments. He does not change, does not always (if ever) watch our matches, but posts comments here based on opinions expressed on other sites. I don’t know if he is mentally disturbed or if he has an ulterior motive in using this site to attack Arsenal.
Either way, he deliberately distracts the debate away from the chosen subject onto his own pet hates, devaluing the site. It is time, indeed past time, this was stopped.
I don’t mind people on here like Florian spouting nonsense about AAA. That’s fine. But I wonder how many of these foreign supporters have actually been to games. If they would be happy forking out vast sums for a season ticket whilst watching all our best players being sold off year after year. I wonder how their view of the club would change. Many of these fans, and yes they’re fans and I love the fact that Arsenal have followers from all over the globe, invest time yet no money whatsoever but they have every right to criticize or laud the club as I have.
You might imagine why people who have supported Arsenal for years are a little tired of being told how wonderful everything is and Arsenal are now a global brand etc. As if fans care about that but that’s modern football, it’s all about raking in the profits. The big fixtures are sold worldwide and the prices are prohibitive for many poorer fans. Then when a lesser fixture appears and ticket sell slowly, in come the poor people again. Arsenal are not alone in doing this I’m sure.
So excuse me if I find all this high moral stance that often emanates from this site a little tedious because essentially Arsenal are a business and you can guarantee they are as ruthless as any other business, the successful ones anyway.
Modern football is enslaved to avarice. The brazen search for more money to be milked in whatever way from the poor fan continues. At least Arsenal are now spending some of the filthy lucre they’ve stashed away.
Anyway that’s why you’re finding a small but growing exodus of fans who are seeking their football pleasures elsewhere, watching the lower league teams at prices that don’t bankrupt them for a week. On the whole Arsenal have got the fans they deserve, rich folk who treat a day out at Arsenal like a trip to the theatre. There’s still a few hardcore supporters who will sacrifice all other pleasures for their Arsenal fix, people like Tony but they maybe a dying breed. Hats off to them and let’s hope there’s a new generation coming up.
Damilare,
Spoken like a typical Yoruba man. We don’t have time for bullshit.
Walter,
I am tired of defending you and Untold against people who project their own biases and failings unto us. I prefer mocking them by calling them what they really are: barely literate trolls.
Recall the ‘genius’ who asked why you wouldn’t blame Wenger for our injury list since you credit him with our successes? I loved your responses to him so much I didn’t bother to get involved.
@Walter, do you believe everything you read? I’ve no idea who you are, you’re just some guy who loves Arsenal. You can doubt my veracity if you like, I couldn’t care less. If you can’t see the point I’m making and can’t see it’s a reasonable one then you’re not as bright as I thought you were.
I actually like your internet persona and I find you someone who seems totally believable. But there’s still no proof but your word that any of what you print is true. My apologies if this upsets you but it’s an objective view and one I’m sure you’d take if you were to question statistics printed by a Chelsea or City blog that found refs to be biased against them.
If one day the great anti Arsenal conspiracy is revealed I will gladly succumb to your conclusions and accept them as true.
Can someone tell Rupert that for the second time that I have seen it now he has a dig at ‘foreign’ and/or ‘foreigners’.
You can tell him I don’t take it personal as being a foreigner who once paid around £1.000 (yes thousand) to go to 1(yes one)match with my kids a few years ago. A one day trip by the way. And one who pays around £250 for his next visit in a few weeks time without the money I will spend in London that is.
But please do tell him that he seems to have some kind of problem with non-English people. In my country they call it racism or xenophobia. Don’t know how they look at this in England. Just tell him as I will not address him personally any more as long as he thinks I am dishonest. Probably foreigner-wise dishonest…
OK Walter, I will tell him.
@Rupert (xenophobic sarcastic AAA sewer rat). Walter has read your comment & noted that you have exhibited xenophobic characteristics for the second time!
Walter, at some point I can understand Rupert and his standpoint. It is kind of nostalgia, when players were local boys, boys you could find in pub and you could talk with them about tactic and results. When stands were place where you go to show how much you hate other part of town, rather than to watch game. When victories were nothing more than reason to humiliate/tease people from other part of town.
But it is something what belongs to past. Those people has to understand, they cant wish to have Thierry Henry without gaining supporters from France and so on.
People who see it different, as Rupert mentioned, switch and go to lower leagues, where it is still local.
And it has nothing with Arsenal, one way or another, it is globalization from which nothing is spared.
Is it bad? I don’t know. Everyione has right on opinion, but when you denying right Running Man to be Arsenal supporter, and true Arsenal supporter with clear right on opinion, yes it is xenophobia.
Does all supporters have same rights? I believe they should, because in “global football” we all paying something to club, from TV rights, souvenirs to tickets. We all do as much as we can, if your salary would be lower than price of ticket, you would stay home I bet.
Ian Jenkinson. 11.33 PM
Most of the general public know what a prat Jose is. As Mandy says it’s our gullible, fawning media that hang on to his every word.
I find it very telling that the rest of Europe dismiss Jose with the contempt he deserves.
Despite what he has won in Portugal, all be it with the whiff of corruption hanging over it, or bought and paid for at Chelsea and elsewhere he carries virtually no credibility at all anywhere but here.
That’s why he’s come scurrying back here with his 1970’s style football. Nobody else wants the egotistical, Narcissistic prick !!!
Walter 10.40
I don’t know how many times you, and others, have pointed this out to Rupert and yet ……!
And we have a saying almost identical. “you judge people by your own standards”
It is a ‘truism’ and one you have to be very careful with, as it does tend to give a very good insight as to the character and beliefs behind the mere words.
Reading Rupert he certainly comes across as a very disagreeable person. I, for one, am pleased he can be read, and summarily dismissed with the contempt his nasty little barbs deserve.
Is it xenophobic for someone to ask the question if someone who has never been to an Arsenal game could feel the same way as someone who has been paying £1-3000 to get to games over the last 8 years? Or is the xenophopic card being played here to discredit Ruperts justified request for evidence and hush a different rational opinion.
I mean if there is all this proof, why has all the evidence not been given to AFC and why have AFC not used it?
I’ve never been a lover of ‘Big Sam’ but every time I hear his interview this morning I’m beginning to like him more and more.
He’s making Jose look like a complete and utter prat. Funny that, because that’s exactly what he is.
Well done Sam, good on ya !!!!
@TJ, they’ll do anything to smear me on here.
I’m surprised at you Walter as it’s quite obvious that there’s no xenophobia in my comment. Or did you just ignore the whole gist of the post.
Yes of course I’m xenophobic Walter, that’s why I married an Hungarian so she could stay in England at no financial gain, merely to help out a foreign friend. That’s why I lived in Russia and married a Russian because I hate foreigners. Oh hold on I must detest my dad as he’s from NZ. And then there’s my Swiss German ancestry.
Xenophobic! Quite the opposite. If anything I’d rid the world of all countries and let people come and go as they please. But hey if you like to furnish me with imaginary prejudices you can, whatever helps you feel good about yourself.
Oh and you can call me a liar too. I won’t get offended because I know the truth.
@TJ, they’ll do anything to smear me on here.
I’m surprised at you Walter as it’s quite obvious that there’s no xenophobia in my comment. Or did you just ignore the whole gist of the post.
Yes of course I’m xenophobic Walter, that’s why I married an Hungarian so she could stay in England at no financial gain, merely to help out a foreign friend. That’s why I lived in Russia and married a Russian because I hate foreigners. Oh hold on I must detest my dad as he’s from NZ. And then there’s my Swiss German ancestry.
Xenophobic! Quite the opposite. If anything I’d rid the world of all countries and let people come and go as they please. But hey if you like to furnish me with imaginary prejudices you can, whatever helps you feel good about yourself.
Oh and you can call me a liar too. I won’t get offended because I know the truth.
At first sight, pleased to see 42 comments on my piece – but then realised that few were related to it and then only the injury throwaway remark at the end! It would be nice to get some (constructive) feedback on the analysis. After submitting the post to Tony I had suggested we change the title to include Man City and Chelsea to up the hit-rate – although not so sure about some of the visitors we had after Bootomee’s piece.
A quick note on a couple of Rupert’s points:
1. Disinterest of fans etc. I was/will be unable to attend either the Coventry or Palace games due to family commitments – and thought my season ticket would be very hard to shift for both games. To my surprise both games sold out quickly – and then my ticket was bought quickly on Ticket Exchange. At games I attend I really don’t witness any dissatisfaction at all, other than the usual moaning that we’ve had since time immemorial. Don’t hear criticism about ticket prices, don’t hear criticism about club policy.
2. Referee Decisions Probity. This is ridiculous! All the data is there and open to challenge (and has been in the past from time to time). Issues about methodology have been raised in the past – and addressed. If a Chelsea or City website did something similar I would be very interested – but they haven’t. In fact, to my knowledge, no one else has. Which would suggest it is actually pretty difficult and time consuming. But there is no question that the reviews have been undertaken – and then the analysis performed!
And I really can not see any reason at all for Walter to pretend that the independent referees who have reviewed the matches do not exist. As he says, he does not have the capacity – and why would he take such an extreme risk to his own reputation.
Rupert – sometimes you make valid points, sometimes I agree with you, but you are undermining your credibility enormously by attacking the referees decisions work. It is not perfect (but nothing is) – but it is still very good.
I am a scientist by training and science works by Scientist A coming up with a theory, Scientist B testing that theory through experiment then Scientist C coming up with an improved version to meet the results of Scientist B (indeed Scientist A, B and C could be the same person). The key point is that if you disagree with a theory you have to produce experimental proof that it is flawed. Just flaming the person who came up with the original theory or criticising in a general way just does not cut it.
TJ if you only left it without mentioning money I would even consider it. Since when is love measured in amount of money you are willing to give for it? Have you ever gave 2 years salary to see only one game? I did, do I love Arsenal more than ones who did’t? Are my rights to talk and have opinion about Arsenal bigger or smaller? How much cost right to talk, and have opinion? How much cost passion?
After posting at 8:26 Am , regarding the ship engine repairman ( consultant) story , I wanted to add that that said consultant was paid in full.
I also wanted to add that story had reminded me of the old fairy tale , ” The Pied Piper of Hamelin ”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zdi3xpLxLQs
( who was not paid of course), but was held aback as it may be construed as being insulting to …whomsoever … but from the tone being adopted here , I see that I should not have worried …. “by the consideration and tolerance you have for others.”
@bjtgooner – Thanks for being our Pied Piper ! The cheque is in the mail !
Rupert, What makes you think that investment of “time” is not worthy. I am an Indian. To watch midweek games, I have to wake up at 1:00 am. I watch ARSENAL even though I risk going late to my office the next day. Fan is what I am not. I am a supporter. I support ARSENAL in good or bad…..
BUT fan is what you are. You need a trophy named switch to turn you on.
And as I said, Walter and Co have published enough data to support their claims. You have all the right to re-examine the data. Or just present us with your stuff to counter their claims……
@Armin, I think you misunderstand. I have no problem with Arsenal being packed to the rafters with foreigners or the fact that we’re owned by an American, though I may have problems with Kronke as a person it has nothing to do with where he comes from.
I don’t care if the whole French nation supports Arsenal and nobody in England does. That’s not the point and I suggest you work out what is.
I’m merely stating that a lot of people feel quite happy attacking others about how they support Arsenal as if they have a divine right to decide who is a fan and who isn’t. That some of these people, whether they’re English living abroad or whether they’re foreign nationals or whether they live in Carlisle, have never forked out vast sums supporting the club and perhaps they might feel differently if they had. They have every right to their opinions as I have mine but I only wonder how their opinions might be different if their support involved heavy financial outlay.
All I see on this site is contempt and vitriol aimed at anyone who shares a different opinion. There is hardly any debate, just coarse insults and numbing rigidity.
Guys,
You give Rupert Cook too much credit by even talking about the sacrifices (financial and otherwise) that you make to see Arsenal play. He is an attention seeking troll who is not deserving of anything but contempt. This is a guy who seldom watch Arsenal play live; whether at the Emirates, on TV or Internet streams. He contributes nothing to the club but only comes here to cause disaffection amongst fans.
Rupert Cook is a troll, please stop feeding him with responses. And ignore his moronic professional victim sympathiser too. Hopefully, if we starve them of responses enough, they will go away to where they belong.
@Arsenal 13. Well thank you for a reasonable response. I admire the amount of time you put into Arsenal especially as staying up late could affect your work and home life. I’m not saying you’re a lesser supporter by not investing money in going to games (I’m well aware this would cost you a fortune and be implausible) I’m merely pointing out that divesting yourself of large sums of money can direct your opinion and you may have a different one, or you may not.
I think we’d all like a trophy, let’s not pretend otherwise and it finally looks like we’re trying to do just that.
I think you get my point about Walter’s figures. Sure I could present my own figures but why would you believe them. In your place I wouldn’t.
@Bootoome, you’re quite arrogant. You have no idea what I do so don’t make out you do. You seem to think you run this site, you don’t so have the decency to desist from making nonsensical remarks. Nobody needs your permission to support Arsenal.
Pete.
See what you mean, it has all been a bit ‘off topic’ so I’ll attempt in a small way to redress the balance a bit if I can.
Early on in the season all the talk was about Ozil and what a massive impact he’d had on our team and consequently our results. My take on it was somewhat different and more in agreement with what your article seems to allude to.
I contested, as much as Ozil is obviously a World Class player, and it’s never a bad thing to have a few of those around the place, it was more to do with the solidity, balance and work rate of the team that had turned things around, and that stretched back to the beginning of 2013.
The back 4 was more settled and the midfield where protecting them better. Add to that the prolific work rate or OG and we was becoming very hard working, solid, UNIT.
It also helped we had Ramsey back to form as well as Jack back.
But by and large it is our performances WITHOUT the ball that has drastically improved and is the main reason behind our upturn in fortune.
Rupert, I do spend money on ARSENAL. I am a Red member and I do a bit of shopping on ARSENAL direct every now and then……….BUT my support for the club remains the same. Of course we would like a cup or two. BUT not at the expense of our principles and values
Hi Boo.
I think you touched a nerve there mate !!!
Rupert, there was another site, absolutely nothing to do with Arsenal in any way, shape or form whose conclusions pretty much concurred with Walters in so far as Arsenal were bottom of the ‘bad decisions’ table. I think it was called Debatable Decisions and it based its analysis on MOTD footage, so not as comprehensive as Walters reviews.
@Bootoomee
I quite agree about the rupert – he is by accident or design a troll, and his professional apologist is just as useless – strange that the apologist appears at the same time as the rupert switches form sarcasm to pretended innocence and self righteous indignation.
@Pete
Sorry not to have commented on your article, too many distractions and as Brickfields noted I reverted to a Pied Piper (happily unpaid!) role. I do agree with your comments about defense, we are much tighter at the back this year & seem closer to achieving a better balance between defense and attack – the transition between each of these is key and depending on who is fit to play, this has been on occasion a delight to watch.
@Pete, I have a very suspicious nature so I don’t trust anything I read. Walter may well do ref reports, my belief is that he does, but I’m being objective here and quite reasonably, in my opinion, doubting anything without solid proof. I accept your viewpoint but surely if Walter is scientist A so to speak does it not become better to have a different scientist B and C. Now I expect the other refs, who may or may not exist, perform this function. But what if they don’t exist? Is then Walter solely scientist A. And with due respect to you, and as I’m not a scientist, if you have a theory do you not have to test it, that is apply it in practice to see if it is correct? I hope I’m making myself clear and you get my meaning.
The question is, would you if you were a City fan, say, accept these findings at face value?
@ Pete – Sorry for going off topic .The figures you give do reflect the relative strengths and their present positions .
ManShitty’s firepower is awesome as are their reserves.
Chelski’s forwards in turn are not doing their stuff in front of goal.Their many defensive midfielders stiffle the opposition but as we saw yesterday may not (hopefully) create too many chances. An implosion please !
Our strength is in our defence which for most part is confident and well settled ,but our midfield has had to be chopped and changed due to injuries and suspensions. They have contributed to the goals in tandem with OG .
Do hope we get a well settled team for the February tests !We did do rather well in January !
@Mick, thanks for that. I did hear of it before and if it did largely concur with Walter’s decisions then that helps to prove his findings correct. Thanks for being non-confrontational too.
Cheers to everyone who responded with a little restraint and my apologies to any foreign fans who took umbrage but my argument wasn’t aimed at your being non-English.
jambug & bjtgooner,
Mike T is a commenter here that I believe you must have encountered at one time or the other. I rarely ever agree with him but I have tremendous respect for him. He is a confessed Chelsea fan on one of the most pro-arsenal sites on the Internet. For me, that is a man with conviction and I totally respect his honesty and boldness.
Because Mike T is a confessed Chelsea fan, I never respond to his comments no matter how much I disagree with them. He is a Chelsea fan while I am a Gooner, of course we will hardly ever agree. Also, Mike T is not intellectually dishonest. You can tell when people post what they truly believe even if you think they are wrong and when people just seek attention by riling up others with inflammatory comments.
Rupert Cook, unlike Mike T, is a wimp who is too afraid to come out of the closet and root for the team that he actually supports. Despite all his protestations, he is a GIANT attention seeking trolls. I wear accusations of arrogance from his ilk as a badge of honour.
Good analysis Pete. If we can keep this back five fit then anything is possible. Remember reading somewhere that whenever our back four of Bac/Per/Kos/Gibbs played a full match we have yet to lose. What a record.
Walter / Tony,
I believe an Arsenal blog is no place for the discrimiinative views of someone such as Rupert Cook. He obviously believes being british, he is far superior to others.
He adds nothing to debate only insult and complete contradiction of his own arguments to cause frustration and distraction from the real point being debated.
Personally, having read some of his above comments, I wouldn’t want to share air with someone like that so personally (and I believe I am not alone in wishing for this), I think it’s time he was banned.
Bootoomee
I once said something to that effect, that I sometimes find common ground with an opposition fan like Mike T(albeit rare but still it happens) but never with some individuals who call themselves die hard gunners. Strange that.
Stuart
Seconded 🙂 I’m all for free speech, but this is something else.
Stuart & Al
Agreed. The rupert has made xenophobic remarks, called Walter a liar and continually made snide remarks about the team, manager and club. He has deliberately disrupted debates on this site. Enough is enough. Red card for the rat!!
@Stuart,Al, bjtgooner
I couldn’t agree more . Ban Rupert along with Sperez, Mike T and many others who dare to come on this site and have the temerity to disagree with the popular sentiment. If you ban enough of them than maybe this blog can finally live up to it’s name “Untold” , although I doubt he very much that’s what Tony had in mind when he founded it 🙂
Al
By it’s definition free speach should be allowed to make you feel angry, disappointed, sad or outraged and if it doesn’t then it is a popular speech:)
Tom
Ok, sure when Tony started this he knew and expected people to have differing views. Which is what we get from the likes of Mike T(not sure why you put him in the same bracket as those other two 🙂 But do you think trolling is fine/should be allowed? Coz this is what it is.
Al
I included Mike T because I seem to remember Walter telling him on another tread to go back to a Chelsea blog when he disagreed with his views.
As for Rupert , I don’t think he’s a troll and even though I disagree with him on many issues and he does at times contradict himself, I believe if Wenger and Arsenal succeed ( win a trophy) ,Rupert will be on here saying “Well done!”
I can’t say the same about Sperez though 🙂
Tom
I don’t mind differing views on football or anything else. I think I explained that previously. The rupert has called Walter a liar, expressed Xenophobic views about Wenger and about “foreigners” again today, has continuously been sarcastic about everything Arsenal. That is not expressing differing views – that is a serious affront to decency and having tolerated the rupert for approx 18 months or two years enough is enough.
“Free speech” has become a one-size-fits-all cop out employed for all disagreements concerning opinions. To be honest, I am sick of it’s usage by people who have limited understanding of what it’s all about.
The basic tenet of free speech is that individuals’ right of expression shall not be curtailed by the state. The state (or government) shall not punish individuals for expressing their thoughts no matter how disagreeable they might be to those in power. That is what free speech is all about.
But even that free speech is not without limit. Your free speech cannot endanger the lives of others. You cannot scream “fire” in a crowded theatre for instance.
Your free speech does not entitle you to threaten or blackmail others. Your free speech entitles you to call the PM an idiot but it does not permit you to threaten to harm him.
Racism and other vices are not covered by free speech, although this vary from country to country.
Now, where private entities are concerned, free speech cannot be used to justify ANYTHING. The rules, as established by the authorities of the private entities, trump your free speech. Gray and Keys got sacked by SKY over sexist remarks against Sian Massey. What happened to their freedom of speech? Well, SKY is a private company and they have their own rules. But freedom of speech would stop the government from prosecuting them if there was ever that intention.
Complaining about free speech on blogs is particularly lame. The moderators can delete whatever comments they don’t want for whatever reason and they can ban whoever they don’t want as well. It is their private blog and they apply their own rules!
Finally, if trolling can be excused with free speech why complain about the anti-trolls? What about their own free speech and the right to ask for trolls to be banned? Personally, I don’t believe in banning trolls – I just scroll past them – but I don’t understand the faux righteous indignation that is usually expressed when a commenter (any commenter) on a blog community like Untold is being recommended for banning by the regulars. A blog forum is not unlike a society meeting in a hall where the hall belongs to the blog admin. Members can always vote to expel a member whose utterances are rarely in line with what the society stands for. Free speech cannot be used to defend such member against expulsion.
@Bootoomee
Well put together comment, I agree entirely.
I find the interactions with Rupert intriguing. I don’t know him (nor any of the other posters for that matter) but rather deal with everybody’s online persona. What I find interesting is that Rupert and some others on these boards seem to want conflict. not just debate. conflict. I indulged in tit for tat posting for a very short period of time on 606 and found it incredibly draining and extremely negative. I left before they boarded up the store.
Now, I would much rather post something and let people answer how they will. I rarely try to defend my post because my words are up there for all to see. Saying something twice in capitals and followed by …you muppet…is rarely more convincing.
Tom,
No in fact it was someone else assuming Mike T was a spuds supporter (and I think he hates the spuds as much as we do in general) and I just wanted to put that right and say that if people wanted him to leave to his own club websites (spuds) it should have been a Chelsea website.
I think that at times Mike T must wonder how some supposedly Arsenal supporters react to Wenger and our team in such a vitriolic way. In fact apart from some banter he behaves rather nice to Arsenal I would say.
So take note that I don’t want Mike T banned or so.
Walter,
That’s Tom not getting his facts straight again. Recall when he accused “some” on Untold of “criticising Ozil since he joined Arsenal from Real” just because you had the audacity to say the he had a one-off poor game by his own standard? The least you expect of accusers is to get their facts straight before impugning the character of others.
I’m still waiting for his evidence of those Ozil criticisms.
Tom,
If you were to make racist remarks, I’d ask that you were banned too. If you thought racism / discrimination is wrong, you’d also be thinking along the same lines so thanks for making your position clear on this too.
Oh and for the record, I find Mike T to be a great contributor to discussion here. He has reasoned arguments backed up with facts / evidence. The other 2 are just moaners with nothing constructive to add so there is no point in them being here. In fact it is worse than that whereby they purposely write things not to create discussion but rather to anger & frustrate people. A typical example being Ruperts contradicting himself and resorting to insults because he couldn’t argue his way out of it when pulled up on it. But if you are happy to spend your time with pointless beings, why don’t you set up your own blog and invite them to it, you’ll love it, you’ll have a great time. You could call it “Rottentothecore.com” or something like that.
We at Untold are stupid, and freaks who like Tony/Walter to think for us (although its the only Football blog that goes beyond football discussion), Walter is a lying all the time about his non fact referee reviews (Yeah no proof my a**, he puts it online, with a description of why he said its correct or not). We at untold hate the free speach and love to have only one type of opinions, and Walter want all those other opinios to be banned ( although i think he could have done it a long time ago when we asked him to). And yes we at Untold always moan about the refs and not about Wenger who is the reason for the World War 1 and 2 and behind the Tsunami thing.
So how about everyone who doesnt like this blog leave it and go to another place or create his own and enjoy his Genius stuff out there, and leave us alone in our delusion! We will appreciate that, or just Stop Moaning every now and then about what you get as a response to the Stupid Stuff he says all the time.
God am in nees for some Brickfild posts
Here’s one from the Communist era:
The peasant comes home in the evening, takes his wife and tells her: “Woman, from now on we don’t have to take the cow to the bull, it’s the vet who’s going to come over to inseminate her”.
The next day, the vet comes in. The woman takes him to the stall: “So, here’s the stall, this is the cow, and here’s a nail to hang your pants of”.
@Florian
Well, a peasant might be this ignorant – though possibly it’s insulting to peasants.
But a collective farmer? Surely not!
Anyway, it was still quite funny.
Pat,
Yes you can say that. I should have mentioned that the joke is old, dating back from around the ’60s, when the “cooperatives” were being introduced. To look at it from another angle, you can consider yourself blessed for not going through that kind of darkness. But that’s a topic worth a discussion of its own. Didn’t mean to offend anybody.
Walter
I stand corrected then
Cheers:)
Stuart
Rottentothecore.com is a great fucking domain name mate!
Are you by any chance in advertising? If not , you should maybe consider it You’ve got potential .
Although that name might be more suitable for a porn site than football blog 🙂
Stuart
If Rupert is British than I agree , he is superior to others . It’s the accent 🙂
bjtgooner
Rupert’s behavior was a serious affront to decency you say . You mean like calling a guy a rat? 🙂
Al, Stuart, bjtgooner
Hey guys! Gather around. I’m gonna let you in on a little secret ok?
Ready? Ok, here it is .
Shhh!!!!!
No one is getting banned, ok ? Did you get that?
Eight hundred visitors per month says it ain’t gonna happen so you guys are just gonna have to suck it up and grow a bit thicker skin when dealing with the likes of Rupert or Sperez and perhaps sometimes even myself as well 🙂
Cheers
Bootoomee
Oh c’mon man have enough courage to address me directly . Don’t be passive aggressive . Oh shit! What a minute . That’s your line isn’t?
I hope I don’t get banned from this site for plagiarism or copyright infringement 🙂
Alright then , I admit , you got me there . I don’t have the date or the tread or the name of the individual who said Ozil was disappointing on that particular day but I do have a good excuse.
I used to get hit on the head a lot so my memory isn’t what it once was 🙂
but the more I see you protest on this issue the more I begin to think it might’ve been you.
You know ” the lady doth protest too much” 🙂
Yes this lady doth protest too much !She has much to be thankful for !
Way off tangent , I know , but Yassin @ Jan.30th 9:08 had expressed his need for some Brickfields titlation therapy !
Somehow I know it’ll bring smiles to most men and frowns to some others – too bad !
http://www.fropki.info/showthread.php?425-TOP-10-Things-Jordan-Cannot-Do-with-Her-Huge-Lady-Lumps
Tom
Did you really mean 800 visitors per month? Or you meant per minute. Either way, I don’t think anyone is asking for anyone to be banned just for the fun of it, or differences in opinion. No sir, far from the truth. You can see from the praise Mike T is getting here that everyone here welcomes a difference of opinion, and much as I may disagree with Mike’s posts, I find them very reasonable and well thought outand I always read them and usually respond to them with the dignity they deserve. Like someone already said he’s a great contributor on this forum. It’s not because we can’t tolerate a different opinion. I see this is the line Rupert, and his co-conspirators, adopts whenever he’s facing calls to be banned after he knowingly flouts the rules here. He always moans why do you want me to get banned for a difference of opinion, do you want to curtail freedom of speech, blah blah blah. The point is that’s not what he’s accused of. He’s come up with things that can be deemed to be xenophobic, etc. Not once, but a few times, and he can’t deny it. Once could be seen as a mistake, but twice or more is just not excusable. He has made references to some contributors’ nationalities in a derogatory way in the past. He’s been here long enough to know where most people are from. I know he’s been called names, but for me(and I’m sure to most sane human beings) being called names is a lesser offence than a racial or xenophobic attack. We have all called each other names on here, so that’s not a big deal.
Even if he were not guilty of the things just said above, trolling is usually sufficient enough to get banned on. Most forums’ Ts and Cs will state no trolling as one of the conditions, and I think he can be found guilty of that too. Rupert has been on this site long enough to know the rules which he keeps bending when he feels like it. I don’t think I have seen sperez make xenophobic references,I may be wrong about that but all I know is he’s a first rate troll. So you see, it’s not a difference of views that we’re complaining about. It’s the bending of rules by a crafty and divisive individual called Rupert. If he cuts out the issues stated above,especially the xenophobe remarks, I don’t have a problem with him.
A couple is lying in bed.
The man says, ‘I am going to make you the happiest woman in the world.’
The woman replies, ‘I’ll miss you…’
Q: What do you call an intelligent, good looking, well informed and sensitive AAAA?
A: A rumor.
The AKB’s Prayer
Dear Lord,
I pray for Wisdom to understand the AAAA ; Love to forgive them ;
And Patience for their moods.
Because, Lord, if I pray for Strength, I’ll beat them to death.
AMEN
Al
I meant of course 800 K visitors per month , sorry.
Tom,
Why the condescending approach – have you nothing of intellect to bring to the table? You are of the same mould as Rupert Cook, Sperez, Rhys Jagger, Rhyle – infact, someone should check the IP Addresses.
I shall not waste any more of my time with you, you are not worthy of my effort.
Lost in translation.
Two blondes approach the perfume counter. They pick up a sample bottle. Nancy sprays it on her wrist and sniffs it.
“That’s quite nice,” she says. “Don’t you think so, Anna?”
Anna takes a whiff, “That is nice,” she says. “What’s it called?”
“Viens a moi,” replies Nancy.
“Viens a moi? What the heck does that mean?”
“Viens a moi, ladies,” the clerk intervenes helpfully, “is ‘come to me’ in French.”
Nancy takes another sniff, then offers her arm to Anna again.
“That doesn’t smell like cum to me,” she opines. “Does that smell like cum to you?”
Al
” you can see from the praise Mike T is getting here that everyone here welcomes a difference of opinion ………. He’s a great contributor to this forum” . You said.
Mike T from Jan 28 2014 at 11:17 pm
Walter et al
I enjoy reading both the articles and indeed I would like to feel that in my postings I have always tried to be objective and I hope respectful in putting forward my opinions.
Ok my Blue tinted Glasses give a different view to those that have Red and White Glasses but if people can’t engage in respectful debate agree to differ than surely we are doomed
Having said all that if the overall view is my posting/ thoughts aren’t welcome then so be it. I will wave a cherry goodbye.
What do you think?
crickets, crickets ,crickets ,crickets……………..,crickets.
And finally
highamsparkgunner
Jan 28 ,2014 at 11:45 pm
@Mike T well guess it’s a cherry goodbye then!
Al
If Mike T says what he means and means what he says, you might’ve lost him .
Brickfields Gunners
I thoroughly enjoy your humor sir so keep it coming . Do you know this one?
A hillbilly had but two passions in his life ; sex and hunting.
Every week he would round up his dog and the wife , load up his pick up truck and disappear into back woods for a day or two.
His wife was growing tired of constant roughing it in the wilderness so one day she refused to go .
She said she would do anything just to get out of it.
The hillbilly gave her a choice . Either you come huntin with me and the dog , he said , or you have to give me some.
He only liked it two ways ; oral sex or up the butt and his wife disliked either .
He told her she had ten minutes to decide while he was gonna go and fetch the dog.
The wife is thinking to herself ….. I really don’t like to take it in my mouth but it hurts to take it up the butt so I guess I’ ll just have blow him .
The hillbilly comes back after ten minutes or so and asks her if she decided what it was gonna be . She said she did and proceeds to pull his pants down . She takes it in her mouth and spits it out with disgust .
It tastes like shit! She exclaims .
Oh yea, I forgot to tell you , says the hillbilly , the dog didn’t wanna go either.
Between WHU and MCFC game Jose went fishing, after a while he felt stick is vibrating, something hooked. He puled it out, and…
Well he caught Golden Fish.
– Let me go, says Golden Fish, I ll make one your wish come true.
– Just one, I always thought there is 3?
– One or nothing, insisted the Fish.
– Jose was thinking, and thinking, and finally said: “I want rule the world, I want be most powerful man ever walked”.
– Come on, Jose, it is impossible, how many things has to change at once for that, I have to redone and rewrite whole history. Give me some other wish and more modest one please.
– Ok than, let me think, oh yes I know, I want my Chelsea to be best team ever played football, to be classiest team ever with tradition and beautiful style of play.
– Fish was thinking, and thinking, and you could hear all wheels in hear head work, and suddenly Fish said “REMIND ME WHAT WAS YOUR FIRST WISH, LETS CONSIDER IT AGAIN”.
@Al I haven’t made any xenophobic remarks. Liar. Don’t go telling untruths. If you knew me as a person you’d know I’m about the least xenophobic person you’ll ever meet. Slur my name anyway you want but don’t you dare promote crap like that.
@Tom @ 1.42 am
So you don.t like the rupert being called a rat – so when you state that lets look at the rupert comments you have happily overlooked: –
1. rupert has xalled Walter a liar, on at least three occasions,
2. he has calling Wenger a French Elephant, he made a further xenophobic comment on this thread yesterday, possibly twice.
3. he has repeatedly make snide remarks about the team, manager club etc,
4. he has called contributors to this site Fascists,
5. he has make sleaked remarks the intelligence of various contributors after they show him he is talking nonsence,
6. he has made comments on this site about matches he did not see but based his comments on views expressed on other sites – but pretended the comments were his.
So Tom, you do not appear to have condemned the rupert for his behavior, until you do so you come across as an apologist for the rat and no better than he is.
So, the rupert denies that he made any xenophobic remarks, well then, on a thread on this site: –
“rupert cook
December 24, 2013 at 12:44 pm
@Mike T. I agree. I understand that this site takes great pains to aim criticism everywhere else rather than the giant French elephant in the room.
I have no idea why we appear to be playing for a draw at home against Chelsea and yet we go all kamikaze against a far superior team, at home at least, in Man City.
Having said that Dean was still poor on the night, though of course that doesn’t excuse the frequent poor performances against the best English teams.”
Looks like rupert, he of convenient amnesia, is a two faced liar.
Tom @ 9:36 am & @ Armin – a real big LIKE from me !
@Stuart, you’re not bright enough to debate complex issues it seems. As for being British and thinking I’m superior you’re way off the mark. I merely think I’m superior to you.
Two hillbillies are having lunch when a woman seated nearby begins to choke.
Hillbilly asks her,”kin ya swallar?” The woman shakes her head no. Hillbilly asks her “kin ya breathe?” Woman shakes her head no.
Hillbilly walks over,lifts up her dress, yanks down britches and licks her butt cheek. The woman has a violent spasm and spits out the food.
The hillbillies’ buddy says “ya know, I heerd of that there hind lick maneuver but I aint niver seed nobody do it.
An old Hillbilly and his buddy were sitting on the front porch in their rocking chairs.
The Hillbilly’s friend was watching his hound dog sitting on the corner of the porch licking his privates. His buddy looked over at the hillbilly and said very slowly. Zeke, I wish I could do that.
Zeke looked at him and said equally slow. “Well you can give it a go, but when I tried it he bit the hell out of me”.
QUE ?
The latest poll taken by the office of the Governor of Texas asked whether people who live in Texas think illegal immigration is a serious problem:
35% of respondents answered: “Yes, it is a serious problem.”
While 65% of respondents answered: “No es una problema serio.”
Bjtgooner
I couldn’t care less what names you call other posters you disagree with ,my friend . Having called somebody a “sewer rat” however disqualifies you from holding a moral high ground 🙂
I had been called names like “malaka”, “fucking polak” and worse by hundreds of people from a far and up close .
How high do you think anything you might come up with will rank on my list of things I might find offensive ? 🙂
Brickfields Gunners
Well , if you liked the last one , this one might be right up your alley
There was a formal suare at the French Consulate in Warsaw and a bunch of dignitaries got to talking about their mistresses and what great lovers they were and how their love making skills drove their women crazy.
The French consul said ;( insert French accent) I put honey all over my lover’s body and I lick it off drop by drop and that drives her crazy.
The Italian consul replied; (insert Italian accent) hhhmm that’s good !
I put rose petals all over my lover’s body and I kiss them off one by one and that drives her crazy.
The Polish consul is listening to all this wide eyed and finally says in his broken English.
I bend her over the kitchen table , f..k her in the a.s , wipe my dick in the curtains on my way out and that drives her crazy.
Tom
Lets see you criticize the rupert for his comments. So far you have studiously avoided doing so. I wonder why? It would be reasonable to expect you to do so before sanctimoniously preaching about moral high ground. Does your silence on the rupert’s comments mean that you approve of them? Is is ok for the rupert to call Walter a liar? Is calling Walter a liar less serious than naming the rupert a sewer rat in response?
Rather like the rupert you failed to answer the questions posted previously – I am disappointed in your inability to answer – I had hoped for better. Can you answer this time?
Are you a serious commentator or are you an apologist for the rupert, who in turn has become more and more abusive as he has tried and failed to knock Walter’s ref reviews?
By the way, the rupert has been defined as a rat based on his long term behavior (I am not sure just how long you have contributed to this site, we have had to suffer rupert for quite some time!) – he was given an opportunity to reform & did not do so, hence he is still categorized as a sewer rat – and will be until he reforms, not that it is likely that he will! But…hope I am wrong on that one.
bjtgooner
Whatever disagreements between Rupert and Walter or Rupert and yourself there are , aren’t for me to render any judgment on .
I personally hold Walter and this Blog as a whole in high regard and I certainly don’t think I hold a high moral ground on anything.
If you are offended by Rupert’s comments , you have every right to call him out on it but by calling him names you severely weaken your case against his alleged misconduct , hence my comment regarding you loosing the moral high ground. Surely you must understand that.
It has nothing to do with me but rather with you.
Tom
Nice try, but your reply looks like a cop out.
The debate/disagreement we are having is very much to do with you. It commenced when you chose to post a comment at 2.19 pm on the 30th and entered a discussion several contributors were having about the rupert – with a rather sarcastic comment of your own.
Once again, in your most recent comment, you avoid condemning the rupert, it seems to be ok with you for the rupert to: – call Walter a liar, call other contributors Fascists, call Wenger a French Elephant, state that other contributors do not have the intelligence to understand his comments when they disagree with him etc.
You ignore these remarks and pick out my pet name for him – the sewer rat (short for depressive AAA sewer rat) – and you choose to attack only that – why?
Because you have ignored the rupert’s comments – and they are not alleged comments, you can read them on this site, many on this thread – you are in no position to lecture anyone who calls him to task re moral high ground.
If you were simply so full of decency that you had to comment on any perceived misdemeanor you would have had to condemn the rupert’s behavior before commenting on my naming him a sewer rat. You didn’t and haven’t even when given the opportunity to do so.
Therefore Tom I have to conclude that you acted not out of decency or a sense of righteousness but rather because you have a vested interest in defending your pal – there is nothing wrong with that – but in your desperation to defend the the rupert you devalue that defense by deliberately overlooking his misdemeanors. Additionally, your own integrity suffers.
bjtgooner,
Tom is the king of the selectively outraged; you know those who get involved in debates not by defending the side that they believe to be right but by questioning the ‘tone’ of the side that they disagree with. They will complain about a side being foul mouthed rather than state why the potty-mouth’s argument is illogical or wrong.
He is not the only one around here. There is also TJ and the odd prudish johnny-come-latelys who sought to lecture adults on the Internet about decorum and the use of acceptable words fit for a church. My attitude to them all is always the same: “I am willing to debate you on the issue but fucking fuck off if you are fucking uncomfortable with my fucking use of the words like “fuck” in fucking express myself” 🙂
No Bootoomee,
As far as I am concerned any adult can speak whatever way they choose. Whether that person wants to debate like an adult or namecall like a playground bully is entirely up to that person