Arsenal News

Live Arsenal News

Arsenal latest news

Arsenal News & Transfers
As featured on NewsNow: Arsenal newsArsenal News 24/7

Arsenal News, Only Arsenal, Blogs, Transfer News


August 2021

If you can’t take the ups and downs don’t bother with Arsenal

By Tony Attwood

I spent much of the journey home after the Blackburn game pondering what to write about the game. And given that I live about 80 miles north of the Emirates Stadium the journey takes quite a while – a walk up Holloway Road (and it really is a literal “up” in case you haven’t done it), an underground ride to Finchley Central, and then a car journey through London, up the M1, change cars just by Northampton Town’s ground and then on through Northants, past Kettering and into the wild countryside.

That gives time for quite a lot of thinking.

I did think of putting up the percentage of play that we had, or the number of shots we had, or even focussing on the time the Blackburn keeper took holding onto the ball.  But he was just breaking the laws the game, and that doesn’t seem to matter any more.

Then I thought of writing “Words fail me” and leaving it at that.  I was, I openly admit, as depressed and fed up as everyone else.

But of course everyone else was saying all this stuff, and this is Untold where as the name says, the articles are not just repeats of what everyone else has said.

So musing away this morning I started to wonder when the last time was we went out of both Cups to lower league opposition in the same season.

In fact it actually happened two years running

1983/4 Walsall 1-2 League cup 4th Neil
1983/4 Middlesbrough 2-3 FA Cup 3rd round Neil
1984/5 Oxford United 2-3 League Cup 3rd Howe
1984/5 York City 0-1 FA Cup 4th round Howe

The York City defeat hurt the most I seem to recall, it was as if we could hardly get going in either cup at that time.

Then, just for the hell of it I looked at the time when we had defeats to lower league cups in other consecutive seasons.  The worst record is….

Watch Arsenal Live Streams With

1993/4 Bolton 1-3 FA Cup 4th round Graham
1994/5 Millwall 0-2 FA Cup 3rd round Graham
1995/6 Sheffield U  0-1 FA Cup 3rd round Rioch
1996/7 Leeds U 0-1 FA Cup 4th round Wenger

Four years of disasters against lower league teams.

Does it do any good to go back and look at previous catastrophes?  Probably not – I studied psychology not psychiatry or futurology so I can’t really say what is cathartic and what not.  But anyway I spent a little time this morning creating a table of the past cock-ups and put it up with a little discussion on the Arsenal History Society blog.

It is on the above link if you want to take a little look.

At the end of the game against Blackburn I didn’t boo, I just walked out, met Drew and the twins Drew sometimes brings to the game, and we sauntered back up the Holloway Road.

Yesterday evening I didn’t drown my sorrows, I went dancing with Caroline, and by midnight it was mostly out of my system.   Nothing like dancing to do that.  If you don’t do it (particularly if you use the old “two left feet” excuse you should try it.  It is sociable, it keeps you healthy, and it is enjoyable.  I dance modern jive and the blues.  But any dancing is good.)

Then more driving, home to a good night’s sleep.

I woke thinking about the match – and reflected that it is the downside of other mornings when I have woken thinking about the match.  Such as that certain game when we beat Leicester City 2-1 to conclude the season unbeaten.  I was there, and the tingling feeling is still with me each time I think of that game.  (I actually cried at that final whistle; I don’t cry now from the memory of course, and the emotions have retreated into the tingles, but those memories are still there).

That’s what a lifetime of Arsenal is about.  The amazing, unbelievable highs of watching the greatest league team of all time in our country, the despairing lows of being beaten by lower league teams.   For what it is worth, my view is, if you can’t take both ups and  downs, don’t bother with Arsenal, because that’s what you get.  But of course, it’s not for me to tell you what to feel.

Drew and I will be back on Tuesday for the game against Bayern, and we will hope in this most erratic of seasons that things go much better for us this time around.

That’s what we do.  We keep going, keep supporting, keep shouting, keep hoping.  History says it will come good again.  If it didn’t, we would not have been in the first division for nearly 100 years.

The books…

The sites…

51 comments to If you can’t take the ups and downs don’t bother with Arsenal

  • Agim

    Of course, we should take ups and downs, but what else has to happened te Arsenal for Mr. wenger to go? Relegation? All sorts of humiliation has happened in the last year and a half….

  • Ken Norton

    All clubs have ups and downs the fact is Arsene has not spent, and sold our best players. Kroenke has not invested and the club should not be in this state. We are quickly coming the laughing stock of the premier league. You should always start with your best team then make changes, The Arsenal squad is far to weak its time for a change from the top.

  • @blacksheep63

    wise words sir, see you Tuesday for more Arsenal fun and frolics and a pint at the Coronet

  • M. Thomas


    Check your comment re Leeds in 1996/97. Yes they beat Arsenal in the FA cup but I think you will find that the were in the Premier League and thus not lowere league opposition.

  • WalterBroeckx

    M. Thomas,
    I think they played lower league football so it just felt that way 😉

  • Andy Kelly

    And Don Howe was in charge for the Middlesbrough game.

  • M. Thomas


    Very good point!

    For me though the result when you lost away to Wrexham in the FA cup in 1992 always brings a smile to my face. Not because you lost but who scored the equaliser for Wrexham!

  • Doublegooner


    I suggest you and the few of you on here so blinded in your written support of Wenger actually start planning some real support for him.

    The support against him now is far greater than you want to believe.

    Perhaps you can confirm or deny the bust up story at the training ground this week between Wenger & Bould in front of the players ?

    Perhaps you can still justify rubbishing Stewart Robson’s claim about Bould a few weeks ago.

    2 weeks ago one of the old back four sent a text to a BBC TV/Radio presenter (who is an Arsenal fan) telling him Wenger had stopped Bould doing any defensive coaching a few weeks ago.

    You’ll appreciate I cannot name names here as you don’t when you state stories.

  • malaysian gunner

    If what doublegooner says about the spat between Bould and Wenger is true,it’ s not surprising the gunners are in disarray.The only way Wenger can stop the critics temporarily is to to beat BM . Then we will see about the next round.

  • i am with you on this journey here. I maybe 6000 Miles away from Arsenal, but every game, i try to possibly watch. Felt sad seeing Arsenal lose yesterday night because Blackburn played the worst game any eam can play. our team lacked some energy and everyone was kind of flat footed and thinking whom to pass the ball. But then again this happens, else why would other top teams falter too.

    I still have my full trust in Arsene. was just disappointed by the energy shown by players like ox, diaby, gervin, giroud WHO could have finished the game in the first 15 min itself. szcesny is presently the only player i feel WHO should be dropped if we had a choice. he clearly shows lack of focus in games like this.

  • There’s no blind support for Wenger here, Doublegooner. You seem to have missed the point of the article entirely; can’t say I’m surprised.

  • nicky

    It’s only those supporters of more tender years who need reminding of Arsenal’s continued testing of ALL its fans. Defeats and victories in equal measure with neither rhyme nor reason attaching thereto.
    Every manager of our great Club, at some time or another, has been subjected to the most gruesome of defeats and labelled a failure. Players have been abused and advised to depart.
    At the end of the day,though, the Club has always soldiered on in the sure and certain knowledge that misfortune will eventually give way to success.
    Arsene Wenger may be responsible for training, selection and tactics, but once the team take to the field he has little control on how they play. He can sub up to 3 men but still cannot totally affect the result.
    Until the season ends and a reasoned regrouping can take place, it is incumbent on all loyal fans to give 100% support to all those selected to wear the shirt. What is there to gain if we don’t?

  • John

    One question I have is why he didnt start with Wilshere etc and take them off when we are ahead??? Even now he is saying he doesnt regret it and it boggles the mind. Wenger own ego is his biggest weakness.

    There was a excellent comment made yesterday by one of the pundits on Sky Sports Its much easier to get momentum going at the start of a game then to expect players to come into a match at full speed and change a match.

    Ferguson would have started with the best and took off players he had fitness worries about later in the game…. its just common sense.

    Some other thoughts we should have won the game but yet again we are moaning about number of shots, chances MISSED and the opposition delay tatics (which will always happen). We need to make improvements to be more clincal we the chances we create (weather than be other personnel or more training). I rather one shot and one goal as oppose to twenty shots and lose the game????

    Actually maybe the trainers are not good enough??? Two areas that have plauged the time in recents years We dont take our chances I cant see any huge improvement in tis area… correct me if I’m wrong. We dont seem to be able to shut up shop completed and defend a lead (exception of one game Sunderland) Plus our players seem phyiscal and mentally weak looking tired and half hearted … get the f**k on with it jesus you dont know f**king born and this has been something that has been going on a long time again with no improvments???

    Football is about winning or at least trying to If thats not the point then why bother???

  • Adrian

    This blog is terrible. No analysis of Arsenal’s performance or situation whatsoever, just telling people to shut up and focus on the next game. I think you should go and support Wenger at whatever club he joins next,. you’re no Arsenal supporter. Arsenal supporters care about the club and its direction.

  • JohnW

    Any football team and manager has divided support. There are those who choose not to slug someone for the sake of it, others think that if there’s a change then things might get better, and yet others go with the flow. Tony does have to go planning for Wenger support. because ultimately, it won’t do any good if Arsene becomes fedup and he throws in the towel, or if the management do something with him.
    Yesterday i was really unhappy, even now. But what Tony said today makes real sense, you can have sustained s**t and then untold joy. Imagine if we could do to Bayern, what Blackburn has done to us, would you be happy?
    That shows that when you support a team, you beware such days like yesterday. There has to be a reason why despite all the disappointment, you still go back to the Emirates, if so, then hang onto that.

  • john

    Can’t see how we can be considered “the greatest league team of all time in our country” its going on 8 years without a single trophy for god sake..

  • Jed

    Tony, you are a man of principle and I admire that, but the missing perspective in your piece is looking at what happened to produce the ups that followed the downs you have cited. What happened to Howe, Graham and Rioch? When one managers approach isn’t working you look at changing things, or at least the board ought to do that. We have a very clear pattern at the moment and something needs doing about that.

  • Mandy Dodd

    Agree, whatever is or is not going on behind the scenes, worth backing the team. But that does not mean there is not grounds for questions. I do not have the stats, but this is I guess …in terms of performances…about the worst shape we have been in during the Wenger era. a classic sucker punch, substitutions, a complete lack of concentration then a goal…stupid. Maybe Wengers obsession with the CL has filtered down? If Steve Bould really has been taken out of the picture as some suggest,(was he in the dugout yesterday?) a man like that should walk, and make a huge statement for the good of the club he clearly cares about. Even a passive board would have to act then. It has to be said, this certainly does not look like a Steve Bould drilled team. If Wenger really has become this all controlling dictator, misguidedly acting against the interests of the club, this should be dealt with at the end of the season. If he really is doing it his way, he should take the consequences of failure, and so far, this season has pretty much been a failure. I never thought I would see a Wenger team go out to 2 lower league clubs in a season. Other blogs, which I respect cite a lack of ambition, a lack of attention to detail, Wenger refusing video analysis using as he said yesterday, the same methods for 16 years.Some say the manager is insufficiently challenged, obsessed with finances, the players too comfortable or even not playing for him, out scouts have it too easy etc. We are owned by a guy some say does not give a shit. But I have yet to meet an American businessman not give a shit about an investment on an undermarketed team of himdreds of millions of pounds. Losing to Bradford and Blackburn is not the best for global marketing. The fact is , we do not know what goes on behind the scenes, this is not an open club that leaks like a seive like City or Chelsea. If Wenger really is screwing things up, the board must hold him accountable. But all this aside, the players need backing, a top 4 finish, we can really kick on next year, but I predict an interesting summer.I am not sure at the moment it would take too much to walk, and the way things are going , the board may just let him. Or maybe we are all reading too much into this and the team have just put in a few utterly crap performances this year.

  • ARSENAL 13


    How convenient. Blame Wenger. AND source….Robson. Robson knows shit. He is a sour grape. He was kicked out of ARSENAL for his negative analysis of THEO.

    I think its the third time this season we’ve heard, through Robson, therz been a bust up between Wenger and Bould.

    Bust Up…really. And we thought Wenger and Bould were professionals.

  • Gerry Lennon

    Tony, you turned to dancing for therapy, I went to my ‘other love’ horse racing, updating files to be exact.
    Over the last two years I have been fortunate to be writing blogs during which Frankel has graced the scene. Despite being widely perceived as the G.O.A.T., on the day of his last run I knew he was in for a tough race. If he had lost he would still be a great racehorse, and I would still be a loyal fan …
    Of course, being the greatest racehorse of all time(over 8/10f for the pedants), he did not lose, but it was closer than the walk in the park that many had predicted.

    Moral of this story? Prepare yourself for defeat, they can happen, don’t depair when it does. Be thankful that you have had the good times, so you can truly enjoy it when they return … and they will.

  • Shard


    I know your opinion is that this is not a Bould drilled team, but in my opinion the defensive shape of the team is a lot better than last season. Defensive drilling cannot account for players effing up. Individual errors and lack of concentration are much harder to account for and fix. Yesterday, if Walcott runs with Olsson, I don’t think that goal happens. Szczesny too could have done better, in at least pushing the ball wide of goal. But, we don’t look so exposed from either set pieces, nor from open play, as we did in years previous.

    As to Wenger not letting Bould do his job. How can we say that he is undermining the club? It is his job to make decisions, which are subjective in nature. If the first 3 games of the season are the roadmap for a completely Bould coached team, then there is no way that we can continue that. This is assuming that the rumours of a split are even true.

    Wenger uses video. He watches and rewatches games on video. We’ve heard of that a few times. He apparently doesn’t playback video for his players very often. There is a difference there. Why? My guess. He wants them to be aware of their flaws and informs them of it and how to correct them, but he doesn’t want them obsessing over them, which might overshadow a gameplan which is based on quick passing and attacking instinct. But that’s just a guess..

    Is this the darkest hour under Wenger? Perhaps. But it is also close to the final hurdle. We should have a much improved team next season, and we should have the finances to add to it. If we don’t do well enough (and I don’t think well enough needs to be defined by a trophy) then Wenger’s contract is up after that anyway. Change is coming either way. But our foundations as a club are strong (in no small part thanks to Wenger) and I don’t think we need to worry too much.

  • Mandy Dodd

    A lot of wise words in their shard but just cannot help but feel something has gone a bit wrong. I have no idea whose fault it is nor do I believe everything robson says. Wenger runs the show of course but just looks to me like he is going for broke a bit.still lets hope for better things tues

  • Kenneth Widmerpool

    Its a difficult subject as everyone was naturally united in their irritation with the result yesterday, so if anyone creates a polemic that defend the team or previous results from yesteryear they are accused of being this or that.Which is a bit hard.After all there are also plenty of places that are doing the opposite at the moment.
    What I personally liked about Tony and Walters blogs about the game are that they try to look defeat in the face and be philosophical about it. I feel really sad at the schism of the fan base and the onslaught in the media who are enjoying the whole spectacle, and this after yesterday has now become even worse.
    Yet alternatively Im pleased for Blackburn, they had a bloody lucky chance and it was a strange goal right at the moment where the subs looked like clinching the game( I felt we looked more threatening once the subs did come on),a game Blackburn spent mostly defending.
    To me its the magic of the Cup,no I dont want to be on the losing side, but the odds in football are against me, so I try to be philosophical about losing, and I recall the pain of the games that Tony lists as being far worse than this,but every fan reacts in different ways and at different times in their lives.
    I think the stats show that the team did try to win, but having watched the game we lacked a final killer instinct or urge.But this team does sometimes does have that instinct which makes it even more frustrating. The arguments for and against specific elements in the game can go on forever.
    Come on, who cares about the Bradford game, good luck Bradford, I lived there for years, that City needs something to cheers about, perhaps the Blackburn game is more relevant, in that we feel we also want something to cheer about.So the summer will bring more players in, and perhaps one or two new changes in the staff.
    I think that if Wenger has another view point on the CL, then it comes from not having been raised in England, personally having lived in Germany for a long time I tend think that the CL means more than the FAC to those living outside of the UK. But its the other way round obviously if you live in England, having mostly grown up in the 20th Century when the Cup was often very exciting, that it may mean more to you.Is the FAC what it was though?
    I was a bit concerned that it seemed really quiet at times at the Emeroids yesterday, as if we believed it was our right to win, Blackburn didn’t want to play to that script, and Chelsea have shown the way to parking ye olde bus in front of the goal.But in the end it was an odd game, we could have won 5-0 or lost 0-1 and we did.
    What irks me more is that the press and probably most of us have written the Bayern game off already. Bayern are very much beatable though and they are a team that believes that they have a right to win the CL,(which is a bad view to take) and much of their drive does come from jealousy of teams from the EPL over recent years, its a chip on their shoulders to be exploited. I really hope we can get behind our team for that game I feel our team need us to do that as much as we need them to do it for us. COYG!

  • Belfastkiwi

    Ah you doom and gloom merchants
    I am attending my first ever Arsenal Match next Saturday against Aston Villa
    I have supported Arsenal from afar man and boy for over 45 years
    I am as excited as a …. well I don’t know what!!
    Suffice to say, win lose or draw, brilliant performance or dreary outcome
    There will be one in the crowd who will be delighted just to have the opportunity to be there.
    A wise man once said of an event, ‘this too will pass’ well he was right.
    One thing I know to be true that whatever the outcome I will God willing still be a gooner for the next 45 years!
    See you Saturday!!

  • Mandy Dodd

    some very valid points Kenneth, but it just seems we are especially susceptable to teams getting alucky break at the moment, with our resources, it could be argued we shouldn’t be.maybe as Shard says, we are better at some defesive aspects than last year but it seems it does not take opponents many chances to score against us, and I feel this is hurting us and is long overdue addressing. But you are right, lets see a reaction against Bayern, they are good, but on our day, so are we

  • I’m very much in agreement with you, Kenneth.

    Tony referred in his article to “this most erratic of seasons”, and I agree. The team have on accasions played really well this season, with a swift and flowing football that I have not seen since the team of 2007/08.

    As to the criticism that Wenger should have used Wilshere and others from the outset, yes I can understand that. However, the proximity of a tough game against Bayern in a few day’s time was bound to temper tactics. You cannot simply play your strongest team all the time.

  • annie

    The problem with Arsenal is that we don’t have depth in the squad, the team picked for this FA cup clash just did not step up to the plate, that said, they should have been good enough to finish them off. There have been lower moments for me, the NewCastle game comes to mind, from 4-0 up at half time to 4-4 45 min later, that’s the last time I cried.

    Yet Wenger has improved the team since then, I think there is more ambition, my only problem with Wenger is that he has to often looked to Ligue 1 for answers, but his recent activity of buying players from La Liga has given me hope, its a league that has so mush talent, yes, I still have hope I never stop hoping and praying, is that not what its all about, the Gunners will continue to give us up and downs, but hey that’s football.

  • Mick

    I agree we are better drilled defensively and that is born out if you examine the goals we have conceded this season. Over 40% have come from individual clangers which cannot mostly be accounted for on the training pitch. How many times have we conceded as a result of a team playing through us with great football, not many. Likewise in most of the matches we have lost or drawn we have not been outplayed by the opposition. In most of these games we have been the better team but have failed to get the result we deserved either through stupid defensive blunders or attacking blunders in the form of failure to convert most of the numerous chances we create. I certainly can’t remember many games where the other team was better than us and thoroughly deserved their win/draw. In other words our results do not reflect our footballing ability, just our ability to consistently shoot ourselves in the foot either defensively or attacking.

  • uk

    True tony, but i think the title should be “if you can’t take the downs and downs, you have no business supporting the arsenal”, cos frankly, in a long while i dont know where the ups have been. certainly not in beating the barcas and milans, with the inevitability of the knowledge that we’d still be dumped out @d’end of two legs of football. It feels like generations ago when we were eliminating the like of madrid, juve, milan.

  • Mick

    If you are not able to regard the likes of 7-5 at Reading or 5-2 against Spurs as ‘ups’ then I really don’t know why you bother following football at all. What a miserable so and so you must be!

  • uk

    Those are your ups? How about watching paint dry? Is that also up enough for you?

  • uk

    i also get a kick out of seeing AKBs struggle to come up wit new excuses for wenger’s failures. That up enough for you too?

  • WalterBroeckx

    Unless it was someone who put on a Bould mask and pretended to be Bould but on my TV I have seen Bould sitting next to Wenger and talking with Wenger.

  • :Pat

    Glad to hear Bould was there after all. Strange some people don’t seem to have seen him.

  • Arvind

    There is a big chance we will beat Bayern on Tuesday… specially after this result. Unfortunately there is also a chance ( smaller ) that we might lose 2 or 3 nil. I think we will give away an away goal but win 2-1 or 3-1… podolski will score against Bayern for sure… did he play on Saturday? – I’ve only read a few reports. Aw is mostly keeping him fresh and raring to go. Fingers and toes crossed.

  • I hear most blogs telling us that Moyes is coming in for Arsene! Hmm what have Moyes won for Everton? Shit happens and with Blackburn it was double shit,for GOD’s sake our shots hit the bar and go out their one shot and only shot hits the bar and goes in!Really this world is not fair and as of Szczesny he is not very much focused these days hope he will be tomorrow. I was expecting Manone to be in goal against Blackburn.
    As of those who want Arsene out, wait until the end of his contract and don’t resign him again as you are the guys who renew his contract. For the rest of us let us get behind the team and our coach and kick Bayern. Lets go GUNNERS

  • Sav from Australia

    Lovely article Tony. Very valid comments from Shard, Kenneth and others. This is such a good team. Why people get so panicked I just cannot understand. League champions next season ladies and gentlemen.

  • Brickfields Gunners

    Thanks for this Tony , its been a really downer this weekend,
    especially as news of the passing away of a cousin was passed on to us just before the game .
    Any loss hurts ,but the loss of a loved one in his prime puts things in perspective .We move on as best as we can.

  • Rupert Cook

    @Belfastkiwi, enjoy your first game and I hope the team turn up and give you, and us, a great night to remember.

  • Rupert Cook

    @Brickfields, condolences.

  • nicky

    @Brickfields Gunners,
    Your reference to the recent loss of a close relative should put into perspective that, after all, football is only a game, regardless of what some people like to think.
    If you are able to accept that your cousin is in a better place, his passing will be a little less hard to bear.

  • nicky

    @Brickfields Gunners,
    Your reference to the recent loss of a close relative should put into perspective that, after all, football is only a game, regardless of what some people like to think.
    If you are able to accept that your cousin is in a better place, his passing will be, perhaps, a little less hard to bear.

  • WalterBroeckx

    Sorry to hear this Brickfields. My condolences to you and your family.

  • M. Thomas


    How right you are.
    When I hear people say I hate Spurs, Chelsea , Arsenal or who ever I struggle because to hate anything or anyone just because they are or support a different football team to yours really is getting things out of perspective.

    Brickields best wishes to you and yours.

  • WalterBroeckx

    If I can add to that : My mother used to say: “hating someone or something is bad” and “don’t hate each other but be good to each other”

    But I haven’t always been the perfect son I must confess.

  • Stroller

    Amazing how the Wenger-Bould row rumour is dragged up after every bad result. All started by a disgruntled old on TalkSport months ago. While we’re on the subject it seems to be assumed that Bould’s role is mainly to coach our defenders to play as effectively as the old back four of which he was a part. A role it seems that Wenger is preventing him from doing. Presumably Bould has no responsibilty for coaching Gervinho on putting the ball into the back of the net. That must all be down to Wenger.

    To some it is taken that just because Bould was a defender then he must be a defensive oriented coach. Given his job title and number 2 status under Wenger I doubt if his brief is defined that way. In any event being a fine defender is no guarantee of coaching/managerial acumen. Ask Terry Butcher, Steve Bruce and Alex McLeish (and dare I say Tony Adams) about that.

  • WalterBroeckx


    In fact if I may add that Wenger in his playing days was a defender himself. And yet he is one of the most attacking managers of all times. And he kept a team a season unbeaten in the PL with a self made defence. And to keep a team unbeaten you most and for all need to know a few things about defending.

  • sammy the snake

    The sad part is that i’m not even surprised when we lose to lower grade teams.

    Tony, there have been too many downs in Arsenal’s recent past. Hardly the best way to grow the fan base & commercial revenues of the club.

  • Mandy Dodd

    Kampala , rest assured moyes will not come to arsenal, he is nothing more than a kick and rush merchant. If we played like his teams with the refs we get , we would be on several red cards per game. Moyes is an aaa love child, a bit like Martin o’neill and Owen coyle have been in the past. Would love them to tell us what moyes has done that wenger hasn’t? Maybe it is his european cl experience? Moyes will stay at Everton, he has done ok and deserves some respect, but has found his level. When the great man goes, we can do far better, just hope,the board are up for the challenge come that sad day.

  • GoingGoingGoone

    I think there are a lot of bi-polar personalities on this board. We are not the top team right now and we have to accept that there will be downs with the ups. Que sera sera.

  • Brickfields Gunners

    Thanks for the messages of condolences guys .My hearfelt gratitude .
    @ Nicky -I do think that he has moved on to a better place as he lived his life as a devout and filial son, husband , father and was a true gentleman.