By Walter Broeckx
What we mustn’t forget is that when Tony started his blog in 2008 he did so in reaction to the Wenger out brigade who hardly four years after the invincible season was already demanding the head of Wenger on a silver plate.
So it is safe to say that the Wenger-out brigade at that moment in time was already rather busy. It was in those days that a comment of mine made on Le Grove was changed by the editors of that blog in order to made me look stupid. And when I pointed out that they had changed my comment I was thrown out.
In those days one could already read all the possible (and well out-of-line) abuse about Wenger on not just that blog but also on a few others that I will not even name.
For years their undermining job has been done and organised. Day in day out you could find the most ridiculous things said about Wenger and Arsenal and repeated by the people in the comment section who proclaimed to be Arsenal supporters but looked more like spuds supporters in disguise.
In fact I remember sensible Tottenham supporters more than once saying that they would take Wenger every day of the week and more if they would get the chance. It was as if some Tottenham supporters had more brain cells than the WOB.
Now I have said it before: just saying that you want a new manager in itself is not wrong. I can live with that. People can always say this and give some well thought reason for it and by well-thought I don’t mean just repeating what the WOB lynch mob on social media and in their blogs is throwing around as FACT!
Because most of the time it is just generalisation that is repeated and repeated without any real substance apart from the fact that it was once said by someone and then repeated, repeated and repeated again until the brain dead swallowed it.
All the abuse thrown at Wenger has hurt me maybe more than it has hurt him. I still think that Wenger is the best manager we have ever had and I really believe that without the stadium move and the arrival of outside money in the PL he and we would have won much, much more. And that is without even mentioning the influence of the referees over the years since 2007-2008.
After his last press conference about the issues surrounding social media the press (and social media) published headlines such as, “Wenger blames the fans.” But there was however a more interesting part to read.
First of all Wenger was right in saying that the atmosphere was difficult at times. I think those holding up banners know all about that as they have tried to do their best to undermine any support for the team and players.
But what caught my eye most in the press conference was this and I quote from arsenal.com:
I wish when I go that the club goes higher up and wins the Champions League and the championship every year. I will be the biggest supporter in the stand because I will feel that I have contributed to that a little bit with the basis that we have built.
You have to remember that when we built the stadium, we had five to seven difficult financial years, where we had to pay back. Out of five years, we had to be in the Champions League for three years and have an average attendance of 54,000 people. We didn’t know if we would be able to do that but of course we had to sell our best players every year and survive.
We survived at the top level and did not do three years out of five. We did five years out of five. I think the club is now out of that period and is in a much stronger position. Today we are in a position where we can compete again financially with our main opponents. But during that time, it was very difficult.
This is said by our manager. A man that some fans (don’t call them supporters!) are abusing day in day out. They (those ‘fans’) openly say that they want us to lose matches so that the board will have to sack Wenger. They (‘fans’) want their (sic??) club to lose matches. Say that out again and let it sink in for a while. They want us to lose because they cannot stand and will never stand the fact that Wenger could win something. And he has won something in the last 2 seasons. Yes, not this season but I don’t consider it our god given right to win something each season.
But I have seen (and deleted) dozens if not hundreds of comments along those lines on Untold. And of course they turn up on other social media: ‘fans’ wanting us to lose matches. Strange support I must say.
But just look at what Wenger is saying. He is saying that when he is gone one day, he will be our fiercest supporter and want us to win everything and each and every year. He knows that if this happens it would make his legacy a bit less in the long run, but he doesn’t care about that. No, he wants this club that he has been starting to love as a foreigner to be successful with or without him in charge. And as I am a Johny Foreigner myself I can understand how one can fall in love with The Arsenal all too well.
This is what I call support. This is what I call a supporter. Believe me I hope and pray for the same that this manager who will come after Wenger one day will win all and everything. Just as I hope and pray that Wenger will do next season.
But isn’t it amazing and also rather sad that this man who gets all this abuse is putting the club he loves so much before his own personal success? The ones that don’t want our club to win things (because of Wenger) can learn a lesson from this man. He wants us to win not for him but for the club itself.
Compare this with the way some part of the ‘fans’ wants us to lose as much as possible in order to get this supporter removed…. As the guy in the stadium said with his self made poster: Proud of Arsène, Ashamed of “fans”. This man deserves a statue.
- Arsenal U21s v Blackburn U21s – The Last Chance Saloon
- Arsenal lost two points for one percent of what Chelsea and the Tottenham did last night. So what will the FA do?
- Media changes its tune over Liverpool, football drugs, the police and social media. Whatever next?
Untold Arsenal has published five books on Arsenal – all are available as paperback and three are now available on Kindle. The books are
- The Arsenal Yankee by Danny Karbassiyoon with a foreword by Arsene Wenger.
- Arsenal: the long sleep 1953 – 1970; a view from the terrace. By John Sowman with an introduction by Bob Wilson.
- Woolwich Arsenal: The club that changed football. By Tony Attwood, Andy Kelly and Mark Andrews.
- Making the Arsenal: a novel by Tony Attwood.
- The Crowd at Woolwich Arsenal by Mark Andrews.
You can find details of all five on our new Arsenal Books page
I am sorry but this reasoning does not make any sense. Does he mean that the fans are to blame every time we lost? Really?
well said Walter, for all the success of some high profile managers there aren’t that many that appear to have a genuine love for the clubs that employ them. Sir Alex did/does, Mourinho claimed to but the way he acted suggests it was always all about himself. Pardew loves Palace I’m sure, but most managers (like most players) are mercenaries.
It is very easy to say ‘oh Wenger is very well paid’ but he would be as well paid (if not more so) at Real Madrid, Barcelona or City
Hey
not sure if you are aware that even our own “fans” sang a song about not being happy till Wenger is dead. It was on twitter by Arseblog.
Very well said Walter, and also Blaocksheep.
Gouresh,
I think that everyone realises that the fans are not to blame for a loss. However, fans have to accept the responsibility for creating a atmosphere that encourages and drives the players to go to their limits in order to win games. (Just look at the support that Leicester got from their supporters.)
Ask yourself if you would put yourself out when people around you moaned, groaned, and abused you every time you made a mistake? The players are human and will respond to the atmosphere surrounding them. Encourage them they will try harder; slag them off, they will be discouraged.
You should be ashamed to mention these top European clubs! Wenger cannot manage any of Real Madrid, Barcelona or Man City, not even for half a season, with his dictatorial style of management,arrogance and gross disrespect for fans and addiction to mediocrity.
Wenger is a fraud made to look good by David Dein.
If he remains in charge for next season, he will be more insolent and abusive to the fans.
This club existed before Wenger came and will exist after Wenger; he is not immortal. The club is bigger than any one individual and should not be held hostage by Wenger and his bootlickers.
The best way to free Arsenal out of the clutches of Napoleon II is for true fans to boycott the games and not by season tickets.
I think is true to say that the present generation of Liverpool fans are fans of the club not just fans of winning cups.
The same can be said of fans of other clubs. Not just fans of the so called ‘big clubs’ but of clubs like Rochdale who have been in the same lower league for over 40 years.
The long time Leicester supporters have been joined by 1000s of supporters not seen before.
It would not surprise me if politicians start climing a long time support for Leicester now that they have won the league.
In football we seem to have those who give their support to ‘winners’ and those who support the ‘club’.
When the club starts losing those who support winners are the first to complain.
It is easy to love a winner and just as easy to disown a loser.
I am not saying that the club supporter is always happy with the manager or the team, the board the club owner/s. It can happen that it is right that the club supporters complain as in the case of Portsmouth, Leeds, Bolton and Charlton.
Not happy with how the club is being run the true supporter calls for change but supports the team and remains loyal to the club no matter what.
Shankly believed that he and the players were there to serve the fans.
It in that sense that the supporter owns the club.
The true supporter understands there can only be one winner and his club doesn’t have the right to be that one.
The ‘winning only’ supporter believes that the team and his/her team alone has the right to be the winner and not worthy of his/her support if it isn’t.
The club supporter understands that what he/she sees at a game is a cameo of what is happening in football and tries to understand the broader picture of what is happening.
I mean the true fans should not buy season tickets until Wenger is gone, because by doing so you pay him for repeating the same mistakes year in year out.
NT just do that.
Good article Walter.
Wenger will love The Arsenal unconditionally as for some didn’t and don’t.
Well written, Walter.
In July 2015, Lord Harris, a director of Arsenal Holdings, gave an interview to the Daily Mail. Lord Harris is reported to have said:
“Money was tight when we moved to the Emirates but it’s a lot freer now,” the 72-year-old Carpetright owner told the Daily Mail. “We could go into the market and probably buy any player in the world, apart from half a dozen who are un-buyable. In the accounts, there’s over £200m in the bank”.
The copywriter has rephrased, what Lord Harris, actually said.
Similar words, were attributed to former directors, back in the early days of the new stadium.
No wonder Mr Wenger has been called names, by those who have taken such “official confirmation”, that adequate funds were available.
Keith Edelman started it, in September 2007,
“We have substantial resources of cash if Arsene wants to spend it,” said Edelman. “If Arsene came to the board in January and wanted £40m for a player, we would have the money.”
Keith Edelman, was the Managing Director at the time!
I must admit, I was not interested in the Arsenal Arsenal Financial affairs before 2008. Therefore I was late, arriving at the table to discuss financial matters.
Ivan Gazidis, was also very bullish about the finances, with the headline in 2009, Gazadis gives Gunner’s boss Wenger the green light for summer spending spree.
Tony, was correct in starting a site, where facts matter and not the fiction, to satisfy the gullible fans?
Gouresh – you don’t have to be silly all your life. Wenger says that fans who do not support are undermining the club. You only see what the TV shows you. Wenger sees a lot more. If I need to explain further then you are more naive than I thought.
Well done Walter.
you’re a true GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONER.
Think Arsenal as a club has had long lasting achievement under LE PROF. WENGER’s guidance than the last twelve years the WOBs base on to call for Asene’s head.
Good article. Arsene Wenger loves football and devotes hours of his time to its study. But Arsenal is the club that he has applied himself to for the greatest part of his career. He has invested his effort into building a club which he hopes will be successful long after he ceases to be a manager. Not every manager cares enough to do that.
I admire your loyalty to Arsene but for me the club is more important. His early years were visionary and his determination to push the move to the Emirates was amazing.
He does not need nor warrant the abuse. He does however need to move on as his tactics have become stale and his loyalty to players misguided ( Giroud / Walcott Ramsey but a few )
Not signing key players has been negligent in the extreme and sadly he should go. The issue is he has too much hubris to do so , so how do fans who love Arsenal react to that? Politely pretending everything is ok is not respecting or loving the club. What do you recommend as a fair tactic?
NT please ask all those fans who beg for change to not buy season tickets. The club will then have true support in the stadium. To be honest I would prefer a half full stadium of supporters than 10 beggars for change.
There a guy outside who collects change for Food for Life. Your season ticket money will be gratefully accepted by Londons hungry.
His 8 million a year makes him a great fan. When will you open your eyes. Wenger has sold his principles to Kronkes money. Top four is Kronkes target and Wenger delivers. Is all about money with Arsenal’s board not trophies sadly Wenger is part of this.
Well said Walter. Some fans, such as NT here and a few over on the thread about the thuggery at the bridge yesterday, are just too shallow to comprehend Wenger’s achievements. They just look at the trophy cabinet at the end of the season and, like a kid opening the cookie jar, if they find it empty start bawling their stupid eyes out. As you said Walter, some spuds have more brains than this lot. They should hang their heads in shame.
Beyond the who’s to blame of it and the nature of real love and true support, there’s still the question of what’s next and what is to be done. While imperfect, this piece today is thoughtful, not disrespectful, and raises some questions on the role of investment given the clear and present dangers that loom for us in the next season:
http://www.aclfarsenal.co.uk/
George Graham is Arsenal’s best manager ever, without him Wenger would have no platform from which to win anything. Graham won almost as much as Wenger and then gave him the defence that played a massive part in all his early success.
Wenger is massively overrated. Money has nothing to do with anything, as Leicester and Tottenham have now proved and other clubs like Atletico Madrid, Dortmund and many others. If only he would leave, but he’s too selfish.
Says it all about the man. He loves this club and when the time comes when he thinks he should step down what a supporter in every scene of the word he will be.
Truth hurts and upsets some people and they can’t handle it but what he said about the atmosphere at the Emirates is the truth. For those who have created this and for those who hurled abuse at the players and the manager well you played your part in undermining our season but you cantor won’t ever own that because you do not have the honesty of this man.
He will have my love and respect always for what he has done for this club, always.
Yes he has made mistakes and I would not ever deny that but what he has given us by far outweigh’s those mistakes. He is a human being with feelings just the same as everyone else but he can take it on the chin which says more for his character than the fans who throw their dummies out of the pram because he has the guts to say the truth about the atmosphere at the Emirates and as I said their are some who don’t like hearing the truth. I hope next season he has a blinder but one thing I know he will have and that is class, pity some fans just have not got it but we live in hope.
For a site which berates people who criticize Wenger {Although sometimes rightly so}, I find it rather interesting how Untold keeps making the dissenting fans the focus, and continues to criticize US, rather than address the real issue – the reasons we keep putting forward for wanting Wenger gone. I’d like to see an article on here, which actually discusses Wenger’s repeated use of ineffective tactics against, e.g., teams like Southampton, or other teams which defend deep against us, and break on the counter,or like Barcelona, who are stronger in possession and attack, and/or tend to keep more of the back {look at Real, Atletico, Valencia Bilbao, etc}.I’d like to see Untold talk about Wenger’s insistence that there was “no player in the Market better than/good enough to improve on his present squad, when the top teams all over Europe were adding quality to their squad EACH SUMMER. I would LOVE to see Untold talk about how our team has thrown away games from winning positions very cheaply, scoring first, and conceding equalizers and winners because we failed, time and time again, to kill the games off. I would love to see Untold reply Arshavin’s statement, about how, when they conceded FOUR goals after having scored FOUR, he was scared to get into the dressing room for fear of the manager – but then, he got in, and NOTHING happened – a testimony to the obviously poor mentality that has spread through the club. How about you guys tell us about these issues, and stop rebuking us for not falling at Wenger’s feet? Do you honestly think, that Wenger, for all his beautiful football, and much-touted “commitment” to the club, would have survived for so long, at e.g. Madrid, or Barcelona, or even Man Utd, with the current situation – a beautiful stadium, but only ONE trophy twice , out of an available FOUR, in TWELVE YEARS, and a title challenge gone limp for the umpteenth time now? Do you Walt? With one side of his mouth, he claims Leicester’s success proves him right, that a club need not spend big to win – yet he HAS NOT WON anything besides the FA cup in TWELVE YEARS – want then he complains about how our inability to compete with the supervisor financing, stating it as a reason for our losing out to them. Meanwhile, we continue being thrashed out by the REAL big boys at the Champions League, and being kicked out by lower level teams in the League cup. Any hopes of winning the EPL are almost always gone before March. Our football is now so predictable – cause Wenger,more often than not, has NO plan B… These are the REAL issues, Walter.Tell us how Wenger is dealing with them, and how he’s giving us hope for a better future under him, and maybe we’ll come and worship him too. Till then, we also have a right to an opinion, and we STILL LOVE Arsenal, whatever you think.
Truly enjoyed the article Walter and the photo of the supporter at the end of the article!
I do agree with NT as well, true fans like him, should not be allowed to buy season tickets, so real club supporters can buy them!
Interesting Real Madrid’s president says that he tried to sign Wenger twice before, but the keyboard warriors think they know better!
Wenger was talking about AFC boo boys who created a toxic and vicious atmosphere for the players to play in at the Emirates. And the boo boys wouldn’t get so touchy and angry unless it was the truth because the truth always hurts, don’t it.
KR
May 3, 2016 at 6:34 pm
You say that Wenger has sold his principles to Kronke’S money.
You know this for a fact do you KR?
clearly notice after the norwich game the aaa and wob especially at aftv on youtube quickly change their tune after they notice the support wenger had from the true supporter at the emirates. some so call fans get angry when wenger spoke the truth about the difficult atmosphere the players had to endure when playing at the emirates. dont this so call fans realize that maybe some players do complaint about their discomfort on the slagged off and name calling from the so call Arsenal fans.
Why is my comment awaiting moderation or is this just a website that only publishes your views?
Is it wrong though to be a true supporter but be aware of deficiencies within the club. We went through a difficult period after building the grove but despite selling a marquee player every year we still had squads of very good players. Squads that could have done more and probably should have. I try to keep out of the politics on this site because my main interest is the football and I don’t much care if Wenger or the man in the moon is manager as long as he is proactive and has the ability to suit tactics to opposing teams. I don’t see this anymore. Wenger had a trick in the Henry , era , we had speed on the break and a clinical finisher in front of the real genius a certain Mr Bergkamp . They one by one left and He switched things a little later and bought in a different style where we passed teams to death with speed and wore them out . Cesc , Rosicky and Hleb could keep the ball for fun and we always knew that the opposition would tire towards the end and we could capitalise. Barcelona were the predominate club promoting this style and they flexed their muscles and saw that our players were tailor made for their methods and so they poached a number and as our players left our game plan didn’t. our squad’s ability dropped and no longer did we have Henry , Pires , LJungberg or Dennis Cesc , Hleb and Rosicky was injured. This is when the new manifestation should have occurred but didn’t . We have continued with the close passing game but now do it so slowly that other teams have learned how to soak it up . We do need change but it is on the pitch rather than flogging the same dead horse hoping for a breakthrough . As I said since my first game at Highbury in 1956 I have seen managers come and go . I have seen the club rise and fall with the tide , I have no doubt that on his departure things will probably get worse but I still think that the two cup wins were on the back of the players rather than his genius . I don’t think he can change enough to take the steps forward and that is why I think he has run his course either at the end of the season or at least this contract . It’s sad but then losing someone always is.
James
The defence that Graham “gave” Wenger was in decline long before Arsene joined. Adams was a drunk and we had no defensive mids worth a mention. Wenger revived them and got a few more seasons of top quality before disassembling them to create the invincibles back five. Now that was a defence.
But Dixon , Adams ,Bould and Witerburn were better especially with Seaman behind them and Keown waiting in the wings.
Lehmann, Lauren, Toure, Campbell, Cole (ie the Invincible Defence) were all Wenger signings.
I am a great admirer of George Graham as a manager (plus especially so as a player), but it is wrong to use his achievements to deny Arsene Wenger credit for his success.
Yes, he did inherit a very strong defensive unit, but he improved their fitness and technical ability and extended their careers as a result. That has been acknowledged by the players themselves. The Bould-Adams combination which produced the 4th goal against Everton when we won the league in 1998 would not have taken place in George’s era.
Yes we will have a blinder and get knocked out of the champions league in the last 16 and limp into the top 4! Take your blinkers off ! And you you will be posting in 12 months time about how you hope Arsenal have a blinder next season!! Grow up
If I was getting paid 8 million a year for failing in the league season after season I also would love football
Menace you don’t even own a season ticket! Your IQ is on par with a sloth! How long did it take you to master the phrase do you want fries with that???
Stan, if only you would read the notes on the site you would understand. If we have a person who has not commented before, then that comment has to wait for a moderator to ok it. We check to see that you follow the guidelines on the site, and if you do we clear it.
As for whether we only publish our own views, again, if you would take a look at the front page of the site, and indeed the article on comments you would see. It is simple politeness before knocking on a door to see who lives there. But since you seem rather angry and impatient I will hold your comments in moderation each time, just in case.
If George Graham had not took a back hander I would not have lost the respect I had for him. He cared about Arsenal so much that he took money when he knew what he was doing. He loved Arsenal so much he managed Spurs. Do me a favour and go back to your Anti Arsenal sites and moan and groan till your heart is content because your wasting your time and energy here.
Walter you don’t even own a season ticket! You are a prime example of an armchair football fan! You come over from Belgium a few times a year and the rest of the time sit at home in your chair watching the game! And you think you have the right to tell me a season ticket holder home and away travelling thousands of miles a year all over the UK in all weathers to support my team that because my opinion is different to yours I am not a true fan??? Are you being serious?? You contribute nothing to Arsenal apart from a few cheap tickets every season so your opinion means less than nothing boy!!
Victor, your opening statement…
For a site which berates people who criticize Wenger {Although sometimes rightly so}, I find it rather interesting how Untold keeps making the dissenting fans the focus, and continues to criticize US, rather than address the real issue – the reasons we keep putting forward for wanting Wenger gone.
is simply untrue. There has been article after article on this site in which those of us who write regularly for the site, set out our views about Mr Wenger, about issues within the FA, within the Premier League, within the media, within PGMO, within the transfer system… article after article. Over 6000 in fact, and only a handful of those are answering the critics of Mr Wenger.
And that’s the problem with commentaries like yours – they take a totally false premise, and then build a sandcastle on top.
To claim that “these are the real issues” when they are simply your issues, and the issues of the other people who occasionally come onto the site to attack what you wrongly imagine to be our position, is to enter a world of make believe.
To James, of course money has to do with everything Leicester is a one off but Chelsea, man city and the rest of the big spenders in the world and their trophy cabinets prove that. Speaking of managers does Leicester winning the league mean Ranieri is the best manager in the premier league? Wen get was right about the atmosphere cause I have been to more than two dozen Arsenal games but a half full Dortmund or Atletico Madrid is louder and more supportive than a full Rmirates
Need a map to the Emirates Walter? After all my mate who supports Man United goes to the Emirates more than you do! How’s that comfy armchair???
Tony you like to check to see if the new posts are not detrimental to your cuckoo conspiracy theories! That’s called being a coward
Oh Stan you don’t know how right you are!
Wenger takes an 8 million backhander every season yet you support him
@ Adam
How do you know Leicester is a one-off? Besides, Liverpool have less money than Arsenal and competed for the title two years ago up to the last day, something Wenger has not done for 12 years. They also reached two CL finals in that time, winning one of them. Atletico Madrid won 2 UEFA Cups, the Primera League and got to the Champions League final with a wage bill one quarter of Arsenal’s and are fighting for the title again now – that’s no one-off.
Dortmund usurped Bayerm, won the German league and made it to the CL final on a fraction of Arsenal’s budget. Juventus have lower revenues that Arsenal but reached the CL final last year, Porto won it in 2004 – beating Monaco in the final, how did both of them get to a CL final when they have never had anything like Arsenal’s wage bill or budget? Inter won the CL in 2010 on a quarter of Arsenal’s income.
Sounds to me like you’ve been brainwashed by Wenger’s lies.
Tony
Apologies now understood and noted. Glad to hear you entertain all views even if not agreed with
Thanks
Stevie p
That is a disgraceful attack on Walter and you should apologise but I doubt you will because your type never does. Go back to that odious site that is where your ilk belong.
George Graham has a rightful place in our history, but he is not the greatest manager, he is a very naughty boy, like most other top managers of his time, but as we know, employees of Arsenal FC were and are judged a bit more harshly than those of Utd, Spurs……or Nottingham Forest.
What Wenger has done for this club is beyond immense.
Some of those that abuse him are so called fans, but not all of them support Arsenal…..don’t believe me…..just go on one of the WOB forums and post a word against Spurs and see the response.
I think Wenger has not always been helped by the prev board, they made a lot of money from the club, but put none back in……a bit like our current owner, but there is no evidence Wenger asked for any. I also believe there have been one or two …perhaps well intended, but ultimately rash promises ….being on a level with Bayern etc these days.
In terms of finances, we are not in the very elite. Yes, we could finish behind two clubs with lesser resources this year, but the trend would show this to be a statistical anomaly. Wenger once did the spectacular…..he sacrificed spectacular ..for consistency on a level a bit below spectacular..because stadium payments demanded that…and he did that out of duty and love for the club. He has not quite returned to his amazing feats of the first half of his Arsenal career…..though the last couple of years have not been bad…. he is up against rather a lot, perhaps unforeseen hindrances, but there is time yet.
It seems that plenty of “dissenting voices” have been “allowed on” this evening!
Wenger has won 9 major trophies in 19 complete seasons. Not quite as good as Graham – but Graham didn’t have the austerity years building a stadium. But far better than our historical average.
I can’t understand why Wenger is a worse manager now than he was when he joined? Good old Ranieri has just demonstrated that age is not a significant factor in managerial performance.
It is blindingly obvious that the trophy drought was due to the austerity arising from the stadium build. Although Top 4 always maintained. Then two FA Cups as the situation eased. But we are still not close to MU, MC and Chelsea in spending power.
I agree that this season is a little disappointing… but we are 3rd, and have a chance of 2nd. Why is this a complete unmitigated disaster? Leicester won – good luck to them – but that is a freak outcome. If you think it isn’t then I assume you gobbled up the 5,000-1 odds and can now retire – or even try to buy out Kroenke!
And we have dropped many points at home we shouldn’t have. Many reasons for this, but a negative atmosphere must have been a contributor. Surely? How can it not have been.
Football is an uncertain game, with a lot of luck involved. Which is why the same team doesn’t win all the trophies every season.
This season is disappointing, but well within the bounds of possibility, and it is not actually that bad in the wider scheme of things! We are certain to finish above Liverpool and Chelsea, almost certain to finish ahead of Man Utd, have a decent chance of finishing ahead of Man City and could even pip the Totts for 2nd. All that with the usual heavy dose of injuries, inexplicable refereeing and a negative home atmosphere.
Worst things have happened.
Stevie p – I’ve been a season ticket holder for many years. I can also buy & sell you several times over just in case you think your two quid is a lot of dosh. You are obviously needing care. You come to a site that supports Wenger & have the stupidity to call his salary a bung. You should wait till mummy lets you wear trousers before commenting on sites meant for adults.
I totally agree Nigel
What childish stupid remarks. Walter comes to the Emirates when he can and is also the chairman of the Arsenal Supporters group in his homeland, has been on Belgium sports program giving his veiw’s on a live match along with a Spurs supporter. He is or was a referee and he writes for this site. When he is at the Emirates he supports his team from start to finish which is more than can be said for some fan’s.
I’m a season ticket holder who comes over from Belfast and have been to all but two games this season but Walter has a hell of a lot traveling to do than I. If Walter could I’m sure he would be at every game but anyone with common sense would know that it’s not possible for him to do so but it makes him know less of a supporter than myself because he loves this club and all it stands for and I take my hat of to him for all he does.
Totally uncalled for and I wonder is serge and his cronies are back but then again I don’t give a sweet FA.
Stevie P & Stan….opinions are like arseholes: everybody’s got one, But you both seem to have more than one. I know, I know it’s a moot point.
COYG
In Arsene We Trust!
Stevie P,
No it is difficult to buy a season ticket when you live in another country. That is for sure. And no, I don’t need a gps anymore to drive my way up to the Emirates. For other parts of London I still need it but the way from Dover/Folkestone to the Emirates is really no problem.
And when I come to the Emirates it takes me more than often a 24 hour trip to get back to my house. I don’t think your MU friends will need the same travelling time. But that is probably because I am an armchair fan of course.
Besides how do you know how many times I come and they come? I assume they come once a season most of the time? Or do you take them over to ruin the atmosphere a bit more and then complain about too many tourist in the stadium?
Those who say how much Wenger is earning… are you a bit jealous? LOL…You can always write a letter to Arsenal to put forward your application to become the next manager at Arsenal.
To continue…
In fact I am a red member now hoping that in a few seasons time I will become a silver member and then will try to get a season ticket and will pay for it. I hope that it will be around the time I will go in retirement and then I will try to make it to each home match then. (Hoping that by that time the state will be paying me the pension I hope I will get 😉 )
So yes Stevie P, I don’t have a season ticket… yet… and that for someone who comes from the continent. Do your MU friends have season tickets at Arsenal?
And then I even don’t want to talk about how much it costs to come over for a match compared to you and your MU friends…
Take the higher ground Walter, Stan & Stevie P are trolls disguised as disgruntled Gooners.
Would love to see some Arsenal fans sitting in a pub with fans of Blackpool, Leeds Utd, Portsmouth and others trying to explaining why it is so hard supporting Arsenal.
Kudos for the site for loving their team and not being a sheep and trying to be one of the cool kids because you have to hate.
Tony, you should be loving Spurs today for standing up to the bullies of Chelski and giving you a nice distraction before you have to fight in the civil war that is Arsenal FC once more.
Stain & Stevie Peepee……….YOU are the cowards and curs…..Walter comes to the Emirates when he can and even comes with his sick wife on occasion, something you plastic shithead aaa moaners probably could never understand. Just because you can get season tickets and see the Arsenal live doesn’t make you anything special! I will likely never get to see the Arsenal live but I am as strong a supporter as anyone….including you two nitwits! Stop hiding behind cyberspace anonymity and grow a pair…..apologize to Walter for your fetid, adolescent attacks and then bugger off to LeGrovel where the rest of your mates are on their knees praying for Arsenal to lose. F**king WANKERS!!!
Walter, these dimwits are trolls, so don’t take any notice of them. These idiots are probably not even Arsenal fans/supporters.
Keep up the good work Walter.
So the Leicester fairytale story come to end with the help of pgmo and a possible doping scam to be revealed sometimes in future.
Do they desrve to be called champions.I dont think so.There success is merely due to the hand of the refs who favoured them and gave decisions against other teams and gifted enough points to surpass Arsenal.
Normal service will continue next season.
If Liecester are true champions i challenge them to finish ahead of Arsenal next season.
Btw they could not beat Arsenal home or away this season either.
How unlucky was bayern Munich? Had muller made the penalty it would have been game over.
Even with so many top class talent, bayern couldn’t finish off the chances. Was tactics the problem or just not clinical in front of goal? Remember Pep is considered as the Messiah to some of the WOBs.
I was hoping Bayern to make it through next round, I can’t stand ‘park the bus’ teams winning.
And it was offside from grizzy before he scored.
Atletico beating the mighty Bayern proves football is unpredictable and its not always that better team wins.
Arsenal being handicapped by biased refreeing in addition to being unlucky have eluded them the title this year likewise in 2008.
An ode of praise to Arsene Wenger – a manager and a man extraordinaire .
May your heart ,body , mind and soul be ever young and blessed with songs of rejoicing and hope .
YOUTH
Samuel Ullman
Youth is not a time of life; it is a state of mind; it is not a matter of rosy cheeks, red lips and supple knees; it is a matter of the will, a quality of the imagination, a vigor of the emotions; it is the freshness of the deep springs of life.
Youth means a temperamental predominance of courage over timidity of the appetite, for adventure over the love of ease. This often exists in a man of sixty more than a body of twenty. Nobody grows old merely by a number of years. We grow old by deserting our ideals.
Years may wrinkle the skin, but to give up enthusiasm wrinkles the soul. Worry, fear, self-distrust bows the heart and turns the spirit back to dust.
Whether sixty or sixteen, there is in every human being’s heart the lure of wonder, the unfailing child-like appetite of what’s next, and the joy of the game of living. In the center of your heart and my heart there is a wireless station; so long as it receives messages of beauty, hope, cheer, courage and power from men and from the Infinite, so long are you young.
When the aerials are down, and your spirit is covered with snows of cynicism and the ice of pessimism, then you are grown old, even at twenty, but as long as your aerials are up, to catch the waves of optimism, there is hope you may die young at eighty.
Usama/Andrew
Cud you pls make an excersise regarding how many points Leicester were gifted during the season and how many points Arsenal were denied by agenda driven refreeing. Pls count major decisons only costing points.For example.
Ramsey wrong offside call against Liverpool.
Gabriel sending off against Chelsea.
Schmeichel not given red against west ham
Southamptons 2 penalty calls rejected
Robert Huth blatant push on Mitrovic at newcastle unpunished.
A number of offside goals by Mahrez and Vardy.
To top it off the 10 penalties given to a team who has 40 pct pocession in opponent penalty area as against Arsenal who play 60 pct in the opponent penalty area getting a shameful 2 penalties all season including 1 agaisnt villa.
Schlupp last minute penalty at king power against west ham sums it all for me unveiwd the hidden pgmo agenda backed by the bookmakers in bangkok and london who earned millions by playing this dirty game.
Rosicky,
The points taken from Arsenal by the wrong Important Decisions (second yellow cards, red cards, penalties and goals) are included in my ‘Table of Shame’ every week.
Without full referee reviews of the Leicester games I can’t give you the answer for them. I don’t have the time to look at all of their games. In the first of our two games against Leicester (5 – 2) Away win to us there were no wrong Important Decisions. In the second at the Emirates (2 – 1) to us; there were six all in favour of Leicester – Simpson should have had a second yellow in Min48, Drinkwater a straight red in Min71 and there were four wrong penalty calls – Min9 Kante for handball, Min37 Huth for holding and pulling Giroud, Min42 Vardy incorrectly awarded penalty for barging into Monreal and Min55 Morgan on Giroud. Mr Mullarkey just avoiding an entry in the Wall of Shame with an overall score of 52% and bias against the two teams of 94/6.
Tks Andrew.
Polo
As Rich, and myself, have pointed out, bus parking can stifle any team. Bayern have world class forwards in Muller, Lewandoski, Robben, Costa, Robert,etc but they couldn’t find their way past the Atletico defence. I looked at the stats and Bayern had 73% to atleti’s 33%, shots were 33 to 7…a bit like when we played Palace. Barcelona were 10 points ahead of Madrid at one stage, but now it’s only 1 point. Teams just started parking the bus against Barcelona, and with all those strikers they couldn’t find their way through.
If Bayern and Barcelona cannot break bus Parker’s, teams with an embarrassment of riches in terms of strikers as it were, then what chance does Arsenal have? Atletico are in the final, through playing negative football. At the end of the result people will remember who was in the final, but not the choking style employed to get them there. We’ve seen this against Palace, Norwich, etc. This is what some fans here don’t understand.
Of course I’m not referring to you Polo, or Rosicky. I know you guys understand this fully, it’s the usual suspects and they know who they are.
what utter bollocks.leicester deserve to be champions as they’ve been the best team so far. it’s childish to say they are champions because they were helped by the refs and all, are you kidding me, they play with everything they’ve got, they lost just 3 matches, 3 matches?…I am disappointed we are not in that position but I know very well they deserve to be champions..i know my comment would ‘await moderation’, why, I don’t know. and would you guys just stop blaming the ref for our inability to win the league, a better team won it this year, if we played the way we should, we would be in that position
So, hotie – whoever you are – you’d rather we played like Leicester?
I have to disagree. By the way, we won two of the three matches they lost.
Jeez. Joining a thread like this late really hammers home how pointless it is trying to reason, debate,etc with some people.
There’s no chance. It’s like trying to tell a mob in the middle of beating you up that violence doesn’t solve anything, in a language none of them speak.
How is it possible, for instance, to be outraged to see Wenger’s name linked with Real, Bayern and Man City, when it is more or less confirmed those clubs were interested in him?
It’s not even putting 2 and 2 together to make 4 to understand that means those clubs, presumably held up as the ultimate, must have had a very different opinion about Wenger than those who think he is crap. So all those clubs, operating at the highest level of football, would have to have been wrong. Can see why that would cause cognitive dissonance.
Just think/ write it out : if it’s true that Real, Bayern, City, or any other big or extremely rich and demanding club were ever interested in Wenger, in each instance they were making a big mistake, pursuing a manager who, actually, isn’t any good at all (an idiot, a Napolean, a fraudster, etc). They were being stupid, each time, and they would soon have realised their error and sacked him within six months. I believe this at the same time as having very high respect for those clubs- their powers and their intelligence. They couldn’t see what I see and anyone with sound judgement should see. Perhaps he exercises mind control on those in the higher reaches of the game, from which I am immune. I don’t know. The end.
Luvyourclub – please can you explain why you are trying to compare Arsenal with Blackpool, Leeds United and Portsmouth ??? Arsenal have the highest ticket prices in Europe and currently th3 4th biggest wage bill in the Premier League. Don’t you think we should have done a little better than we did with Leicester City and Spurs as our main rivals this season ???
@Al, I understand it wasn’t directed at me, it’s all good.
It’s annoying to read comments from WOBs that AW doesn’t know tactics and that his methods are dinosaur age etc. when according to pundits and most people Bayern Munich and Barcelona at the moment are the two best teams in Europe but they themselves are having trouble finishing off well organized park the bus teams. They created a lot of chances but wasn’t clinical in front of goal, just like Arsenal this season. It can’t be that hard to understand that it’s not the tactics that is the problem it’s the finishing. Poor finishing is due to most of our attacking players were out of form for most part of the season either due to returning from injuries or confidence. If AW can fix this either with a new strike team or somehow get the current strike team firing to their potential next season, we could win the league.
@ Rich, totally agree with you, if the biggest clubs in Europe wanted AW surely they all can’t be wrong in their assessment. Whether he will be successful at those clubs is a different matter, but for those clubs to want AW means he is highly respected and know a thing or two about football. The ex-president of Real Madrid tried a few times to lure AW to his club but was unsuccessful due to AW’s loyalty, commitment , and love for Arsenal.
It’s amazing some of the WOBs think they know more about football then AW, when they probably haven’t managed a football club in their life. Surely, if they think they are that much better than AW then the £8 million annually is a great incentive to try everything you can to get his job.
‘There is only one Arsene Wenger’!!!
Still off topic,
Just thought I’d go and see what stats Atletico managed over the 4 legs in the quarters and semis. Turns out against Bayern they managed 26% at home and 27% away. Against Barcelona they managed 23% at home and 26% away. So in all four matches they couldn’t manage to hit 30% even on a single occasion. But they’re in the final.
Sounds like di Mateo’s Chelsea side that also managed to win the final without really having mounted an attack of any sort in the semis or the final itself. I’ll be rooting for them in the final if City don’t make it but this isn’t football, and I know what I’d be happy to pay to watch. I hope City pulls it off tonight, Pellegrini is a decent man & deserves it, enough respect.
Al
To call Atletico’s style of play as “parking a bus” is so overly simplistic it doesn’t surprise me a bit that it would come from you.
There’s so much more nuance to Simeone’s defense, like pressing out wide when the whole team shifts, pressing high up the pitch on cue,springing traps all over the pitch to create turnovers, and finally shifting from zonal to man marking in an instance for a play or two before falling back into zonal marking again.
Just because Atletico allows teams to have the bulk of the possession and therefore are a primarily a defensive team, they aren’t your typical bus parking club.
I suppose you could call their style as “negative football” , but to call them a “bus parkers ” is just missing the point.
Dear Walter & team.
U said something interesting..WOBS shld state their case with facts. Here’s why I want him gone.
Not winning the league for 12 years.
Worse than (a) above?Consistent delivery of Epl jan-may collapse back to back for more than 8 years.
I semifinal in the UCL since his reign.
Worse than (b) above? Back to back to back flops @ round of 16 in the UCL.
The last transfer season, we had emerged from the shadows of debt,he had control over who to buy & sell, we had a bit more financial muscle and he came out over and over and said,he along with the myriad of scouts scattered all over the world, could not find any outfield player better than what he has esp the strike force of Walcott & giroud even tho he knew that welbz will be out for a long time. That’s negligence of the highest order! We went into the season with the two least potent strikers amongst the top four big teams. ( will anyone here honestly…honestly… tell me that at the start of this season,if he/she had to choose, will take giroud/Walcott over aguero/bony? Or rooney/martial? Or costa/remy/falcao?) Yes they are all more or less flopped this season but these other teams could afford to as they have won it @ least twice in the last 10 years.
I think when a team keeps a tempo of 1 step forward,1 step back,people deserve to say “hey maybe? Let’s change the band leader.” Of course some let emotions take over and go about it the wrong way but that’s basically the storyline. Let’s try someone else.
I don’t want to go into debatable issues like character and lack of it cos it’s unquantifiable.but I am pretty sure wenger’s def of that quality differs from what is peharps in the
Normal human dictionary. He has done a great job.he deserves to be sent off in a grand manner.this season is gone. If i were him ( but what do i know?) I will say” am sorry, forgive me and my team, and give me one more season to have a shot @ this” follow up with a good transfer window ( personally I am more intrested in the outs that the ins) and believe me, the home support @ least @ the beginning of next season will be better. What will it cost him to apologise? Nothing but his pride. And knowing Wenger it’s a price to dear to pay which still confirms what am saying….it’s time for him to go.
Can the AKBS give me 2 relevant facts supporting why Wenger should stay beyond next season?
Something worth holding on to? Not unquantifiables like tiki taka and top 4? There are sadly no prizes for those.
Al polo Rich
Good posts. Totally agree and excellent analysis reharding parked bus and negative footbal which is a trade mark of Simeone and Mourinhio.
Tom if you find such kind of football i think you should change loyalties.
Frankly speaking i would like to play the Arsenal way of attacking football and accept to lose a match rather play the negative Maureen/siemone stuff.
What the WOB don’t seem to be able to understand was that Wenger was speaking about the days when he will be no longer manager of Arsenal. So them bringing up whatever amount of £££ paid to Wenger now is completely irrelevant.
FA cup 2014 & FA cup 2015, CS 2014 and CS 2015.
That’s 4 reasons why I want him to stay till the end of his contract. We won those things. FACT!
Rosicky@Arsenal
If I find such a kind of football …. attractive ?????
I don’t mind it, which it doesn’t mean I would want to see it at Arsenal.
Having said that, I won’t begrudge somebody else their success because of their style of play.
Btw, Arsenal possession stats against Bayern and Barca are in line with Atleti’s. Talk about lack of self awareness 🙂
Are we a bus parkers then?
Tony,
Victor above may well have mischaracterized the admirable breadth and depth of coverage of many football issues. And his tone is a bit screeching. But he does raise 4-5 points which could be legitimately discussed and debated. Had he not started with an easy to refute statement (which you did), and made his points with detail and calm, then you would not have been able to characterize them as “sandcastles”. By doing so, an opportunity to directly refute any of them has been missed. Since the substance of some of those issues will still be on tap for next season, there will be ample opportunity for you, Victor, me, anyone, to get into the meat of the matter. But that too will best be addressed after the summer transfer window: to give AFC a chance to respond to this season’s deficiencies (if I may suggest there have been a few).
Tom
Best insights I ever got into defensive mindset were from a Spanish journalist book about Mourinho’s three years at Madrid.
The thing it made clear was how total the commitment has to be to defensive football to reach those levels. It spelled out that to get there involves, among all the rest, a willingness to hold back when teams are there for the taking. A willingness to, at times, play with two or three defensive midfielders when you barely need one of them
Of course, this was specifically discussing Real madrid, with their players and resources of the time, but the same principle applies to all teams with very defensive mindsets. Madrid, as i said, is a weird place to explore it, as the stats of Mourinho’s time there show lots and lots of goals.
But as this journalist laid out in detail the games over those three years it was clear that there were many occasions when a team with a staggering array of attacking talent played far more cautiously than the circumstances seemed to call for. That’s what the extreme defensive mindset is all about- it can’t be switched on and off only in the perfect circumstances for it, there needs to be this extreme commitment to it.
In other words, if you’d like to see us emulate that approach it would require pretty much the exact opposite mindset to the one we have. With that comes a period of trying to reach those highest levels of defensive play, during which the fans have to put up with strange sights- holding back when attack seems to obviously be the better choice- and bitter disappointments (games where you lose without having given anything like your all to win, i.e where you hold back a lot, concentrating on defence, and your counter-attack goal doesn’t happen but the opposition do score)
All that has to be accepted if you want to reach those levels of defensive play, or rather try to. You might not succeed. It’s also a near guarantee that if you are really committed, first and foremost, to reaching the highest possible levels of defensive play, you’ll also end up heading towards the maximum levels of cynicism in your play.
Simeone’s team has reached a remarkably high level, of defensive counter-attacking football and of successful football, but I think it has to be faced that if that is what you lust after this would mean completely abandoning our football ideas of the last two decades and near enough starting from scratch, albeit with some fine players who you may be able to repurpose.
As well as all the other things he has done so well, Simeone’s biggest achievement so far might be that the levels of commitment to the cause and style simply aren’t dropping from his players. This is unusual. Mourinho above all others must marvel at how he has achieved that.
Last night is an awful example to use to try persuade someone Simeone’s ways are not the ideal ways, but I’ll try nonetheless : it just felt unreal that a team who are actually packed with players with excellent technique could be eliminated at that stage, from a winning position, having not even offered the sort of countering threat a Swansea or Palace or West from can pose to us.
Of course, Bayern missed their pen, Simeone made a good change at half time, Boateng made a bad call and they then finished the subsequent counter brilliantly.
Aye, a stinker of an example to try convince anyone Atletico’s ways are not wonderful. Can’t help but try,though.
Far more so than with attacking play at a big club, the margin for error is tiny, i.e if you are to commit to that play, bloody hell you have to become great at it in a short period of time. If you are just ok at it, or mixed, or even quite good, fans of a big club will have very little time for what is on offer, with plenty of justification.
Why is it that when anybody calls for Wenger’s exit is dismissed as anti arsenal? Personally I want him gone since he has taken the club as far as he can. You only need to look at this season and many other seasons to see and understand that wenger cannot take this club to the next level.
I want wenger gone because he has failed to compete mostly in the last six seasons. I’m not saying that we must win every season. I want us to atleast compete and not collapse every season like we have been doing over the past six seasons.
Tom
Agree we couldnt match Barca or Bayern posession stats when we play them.
Obviously due to thr quality they have.
But do you want us to play defensive type of football Maureen and Simeone play against lower teams also.
Mind you we will be more successful winning 1 nil in such case but then would you wait for the weekend to see the boring stuff.
Emirates faithfulls will prefer to sit back home than to go to the stadium if Simeone or Mouriniho type managers get to manage Arsenal.
James
You know how Inter won the CL with a quarter of Arsenal’s income. Well, no idea if that’s an accurate stat, but you should prob be interested, truth seeker you are, in the fact they lost 509 million Euros in the three previous years.
Half a billion Euros. That’s probably meaningful information.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/442218-the-price-of-inters-success
It’s hard to get a total defensive commitment from players like Hazard for example, that’s why Mourinho failed against PSG last season, where as Simeone doesn’t have superstars in his squad, that’s why it’s easier for him to get the maximum defensive output from his players.
But I agree, to bring in Simeone when Wenger retires would constitute a total departure from this Arsenal and Im not sure it would work with the players we have.
I can’t imagine Ozil or Cazorla being thrilled at a prospect of playing in a system like Simeone’s
Tom,
There is only one way to describe a team that has 23% overall possession, and that’s parking the bus. It doesn’t matter if they manage a swift counter or are effective at corners.
You say our stats against Barcelona are similar? I beg to differ. I don’t believe we have ever scored less than 30% against anyone in this world. Without looking at the stats I’d say we were probably around the mid thirties, which is expected for anyone playing against Barcelona.
Your argument that I’m confusing ceding possession, I think Arsenal actually got this better than Atletico. We had 20 shots, more than Barcelona, with less possession. Atletico have had dismal shots, overall they were camped in their 18 yard box. I think people find it easy to slag Arsenal off, someone here said we were dreadful at the ems, till I went and pulled out stats that showed we had 11 touches in their area compared with two for them in ours in the first 30 minutes…..
Anyway, 23% is atrocious, it doesn’t matter what you’re trying to achieve. It’s like a boxer knocking out his rival after sucker punching him, but overall having thrown like 10 landed punches against 300. That’s not a spectacle, and you’ll be short changing the fans.
‘Can the AKBS give me 2 relevant facts supporting why Wenger should stay beyond next season?’
50,000+ Arsenal supporters at the Emirates Stadium want AW to stay. That’s all that matters. Anything else is irrelevant.
Not sure why people on the Internet think Atletico Madrid is a small club? According to Forbes they are 16th richest club in the world, 3rd richest in Spain.
Copied from Wikipedia:
‘In terms of UEFA competition titles won, Atlético Madrid is Spain’s 3rd most successful club behind Real Madrid and Barcelona. In terms of the number of titles, Atlético Madrid is the fourth most successful club in Spanish football, behind Real Madrid, Barcelona and Athletic Bilbao.’ They are not a low budget club.
good afternoon everyone, an interesting article from Walter.
I am looking forward to how Mr Wenger responds this summer to the criticism he has received from some “supporters”
it will still be an amazing achievement if we are able to finish second this season
Interesting article.
https://m.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/3j9uax/top_4_leagues_clubs_expenditures_earnings_and_net/
Loop, this is where we differ.
In the last six seasons, the period you have determined, Mr Wenger has delivered two FA Cups and champions league football every season. Within the context of not having as much money as Man C, Man U and Chelsea, I think that is not bad – considering that those clubs have only exceeded us by a little, and have not had to build a new stadium.
Loop this is just a personal opinon that “You only need to look at this season and many other seasons to see and understand that wenger cannot take this club to the next level.” I look and I dont see that.
But also I don’t feel that anyone who wants Mr Wenger to go is anti-Arsenal, only if they wage a campaign to have him leave, for the simple reason that this campaign is very unlikely to have a positive effect on the club. I think of outcomes, not of campaigns.
chibyke – I don’t know why I bother, but it would help if you got your “facts” straight.
1. You can’t remember we were in a CL final in 2006…?
2. Not 8 seasons of Jan-May PL collapses – several times we came from behind with great late runs to secure CL qualification.
3. Giroud is a better player than ALL you name other than Aguero. Costa possibly – but I wouldn’t want him in the team anyway due to his repugnant personality.
Red Member – we have had the issue of “highest price in Europe” time and again, and each time I ask for comparative figures and they don’t arrive. It is wholly untrue that Arsenal have the highest prices in Europe, and thus since your initial premise is false, the whole argument falls flat.
We have had all the footballer of the year awards, but if there was to be a “Specialist in Failure ” award for the season, could anyone beat WOB God Jose Mourinho to that accolade?
When given short term goals Arsene has shown what he can do, titles, doubles, and an unbeaten season, so to doubt what he could do at RM, Barca, and any other club willing or able to throw huge amounts of money at the team is ridiculous.
Not many managers however have proven that they can manage with long term ambition, to transform a club, to manage a team through transition after transition paying off a stadium, being unable to keep their best players and replacing with young unproven players…
Anyone that cares to listen or educate themselves on the matter knows that Arsene effectively gave up his chance to chase silverwear, and to write his name in the history books, by spending whatever he wanted at the choice of the bigget clubs in the world, instead he chose to help build Arsenal into the club we all see before us, a club with almost unlimited possibility, we are incomparable to the club he took over as manager of, I wonder if he ever believed he would be so underappreciated by so many…
ob1977
You got it in a nutshell!
ob1977,
Hear, hear
Tony Attwood – on the official Premier League website it states that Arsenal have the highest average season tickets £1,014. The second highest are Spurs £880. No I do not have figures for the rest of Europe but I can assure you that they are lower than the Premier League. Arsenal with the highest ticket prices have not now challenged for the title for over a decade.
chibyke – each season Wenger brings in circa £50 million by finishing top 3 or 4 of the league. That is more than a lot of trophies. A trophy costs about £300 to manufacture. The competition for it is where the money is. Winning gets the best return but does not mean anything if you dont win consistently.
chibyke what have you earned in the last 20 years for the company you work for? Is it any where close to a million? You can understand that talk is cheap but action costs a lot of money that you & all the WOBs couldn’t put together in 5 years let alone in a season.
ob 1977 – spot on. Well put. It is embarassing what these WOBs have done to such dedication.
Ok if you are chasing the dollar then that’s fine ,but is that the purpose of a football club ?
@ Porter. Copied from Wikipedia:
”Sport (UK) or sports (US) are all forms of usually competitive physical activity or games which,[1] through casual or organised participation, aim to use, maintain or improve physical ability and skills while providing enjoyment to participants, and in some cases, entertainment for spectators.’
Football is a sport, so for me I want Arsenal players to play to their maximum potential and show case their skills. Ofcourse I want the team to win but if they give their all and lose then it’s fine with me.
Average season ticket prices are themselves misleading, and indeed only one measure. Arsenal season ticket holders also get cup tickets included in the season tickets which others don’t get – and indeed for the last 19 years that has included Champions League tickets. Arsenal season tickets do not include league cup matches which are priced at £10 and £20, whereas other clubs charge full whack. Indeed Chelsea fans couldn’t believe their luck when they came to the Ems for £10 for a League Cup game. 25% of the price charged at their ground.
All that is before you factor in the quality of the seats. Many grounds,such as Tottenham’s, have restricted view seats, and seats of other types of poor quality – as indeed we had at Highbury because it was converted stadium.
If you want to play games with numbers of course you can, but if just choosing one parameter, and indeed a misleading parameter at that, you really should say that is what you are doing, otherwise you will be accused of deliberately misleading.
to the season ticket holder who keep moan n moan n moan, if the season ticket price is to high for u just cancelled it will ya.if u cant afford it dont have it, simple as that.surely the waiting list for season ticket for Arsenal football club keeps getting longer every year despite the aaa n wob flocks keeps banging their drum that Arsenal football club is in dire state as long as Arsene Wenger still be the club manager. just look at their agenda all over the internet now days, whether on the sports blog or on the youtube channel. its getting pathetic, even if the team draw now days is a meltdown, abuse the manager or the players who having a tough day n of cos wenger gotta go for the aaa n wob flocks. they expect the team must win every games no matter what cos wenger wage is 8 millions a year. dont they realise that wenger get paid according to the contract prepared by the club n he one of the highest paid manager cos of his loyalty and commitment plus his service for the club. maybe this aaa n wob flocks doesn’t really know what professional really mean n quite sure if they were giving a chances to run the club they will run it to the ground.
walter kindly explain why wenger always finishes 9 to 12 points behind the eventual champions for the past 12 seasons. …
This article has been cut. Evidence is one thing, but the evidence behind an accusation has to be accurate!
Bushido that’s a kind of baseless argument, you could say that the season ticket holders that want change want it so that they can use their tickets to regain the pleasure of having them that they feel that they have lost over the years. In their innermost feelings I doubt that any Arsenal supporter is particularly happy finishing league seasons as we have done consistently over the last few years . Some face up to it and others look for excuses to salve their hurt. It’s the nature of humanity.
I give up! @ menace,what have u just said? Wenger’s brings in money and that’s better than trophies?really?
@ Pete, funny enough u simply concurred with what I have said? 1 UCL final in 2006= 1 UCL final in wenger’s reign
Strong runs to finish secure top 4 spot…. now that’s defeatist.u r saying Wenger deserves applause for a strong finish to grab top 4?hello!!! Is top 4 what we aim for @ the start of the league?
@ tony,don’t u feel funny scrapping @ the button of the barrel to come up with trophies we have won in the past 12 years….2 FA cups is a valid trophy to acknowledge. Now 2 charity shield? How can u unashamedly count that as a trophy?
Please I pray you,tell Wenger to apologise to the fans via one of his numerous pressers and go to work on the team.